From mcurtis@inetport.com Sat Aug 31 14:58:51 PDT 1996
Article: 61316 of alt.revisionism
From: mcurtis@inetport.com (Mike Curtis)
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Re: Mike Curtis-this Bud's for you
Date: Sat, 31 Aug 1996 15:05:36 GMT
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rblackmore@juno.com wrote:

>To M. Curtis re:   Your questions
>Allow me to answer and embarrass YOU.

I'm red faced, believe me!

>  Concerning #1:  According to Louis Lochner,
> the Goebbels diaries had been "lying around" on the ground for some 6 weeks before 
>the Americans even got there.

>  I find it incredible that the Soviets, who were so 
>assiduous that they dismantled 80% of German industries, factories, etc. and sent them 
>on to the Soviet Union BEFORE the Americans arrived, would have deliberately overlooked 
>these documents.  Accept them if you wish, but I accept them with extreme 
>reservations.
>

What reservation are left after considering what is known?

There have been three publications of the Geobbels diaries. 

1. _The Goebbles Diaries_ edited and translated by Louis P. Lochner,
Doubleday, 1948, Award Books (paperback), 1971.

2. _The Final Entries 1945, The Diaries of Joseph Goebbels_, edited
and Introduced by Hugh Revor Troper, Avon Paperbacks, 1979.

3. The Goebbels Diaries 1939-1941, Translated and Edited by Fred
Taylor, Putnam, 1983.

I find it interesting that you take the earliest publication to
complain with. Lying on the ground is nothing exceptionally new when
it comes to finding documents. The Nag Hammadi Library was found in
1947 inside jars by an Arab. His wife even wrapped fish with some of
the documents. Now they are studied by scholars in order to understand
early Christianity. They have a history of crime and sale behind them
but this doesn't lessen their genuineness. A couple of parchments were
found in the desert sands, which is a fantastic preservative, and
these are now part of the Biblical historical record. Diaries are
found in attics and in shops decades after the deat of the writer.
Some are found to be fakes and some are found to be real. Let's look
at the Goebbels Diaries which were trampled by soldiers as they passed
through various grounds destroying records and tapes in anger while
they watched out for enemy snipers.

When the Lochner Book came out in 1948 there was a note from the
government that reads: ". . . No representative of the interested
agencies of the United States Government has read the original
manuscript or the translation of excerpts therefrom. The Department of
State desires, as a matter of policy, to encourage widespread
publication of documents such as this purports to be, of significance
in the field of foreign policy, and has therefore not objected to the
publication. The United States Government . . . neither warrants nor
disclaims the authenticity of the manuscript upon which this
publication is based, and neither approves nor disapproves of the
translation, selection of material, annotation, or other editorial
comment contained herein. . . ."

I don't know that I, personally, have seen anything like this before,
but then this isn't my period of usual study. It is becoming that way,
however. So with the ignorance presented by the US government in mind,
what does Lochner say?

He says that the Russians went through official archives "with more
vigor than determination" destroying, shipping, and leaving some
material underfoot. He admits that their system of arranging documents
wasn't very controlled. The contents of his 1948 publication came from
pages found in the courtyard of Goebbels ministry. Because some of the
pages were singed and smelled of smoke, Lochner assumed they had
escaped burning. "Apparently they were originally bound in the German
type of office folder. Thin metal strips in te salmon-colored binders
were run through holes punched in the paper, bent over, and locked
into place." [1] When the Russians left the papers were retrieved by
"amatuer Junk dealers" who took more care of salvaging the contents
than the Russians did. They ended up with 7,000 sheets of paper. [2]

What else was found with the papers that would eventually be printed
as the Goebbels diaries? I'll only list a few:

1. A six-page radio address, corrected by Goebbels in blue pencil,
dated October 3, 1944

2. A list of 15 articles of clothing for charity dated June 10, 1942.
Also there was a note that pointed out that Mrs. Goebbels could do
nothing about her donation until she spoke with her husband.

3. A letter of 1/26/1939 that notified Goebbels that taxes on his
property had increased. [3]

4. A typed balance sheet of Goebbels income.

5. A handwritten analysis of Goebbels income from 1933-1937. [4]

6. Records of gift giving to various party officials such as Sauckel,
Steicher, Ley, Hierl, Schaub, and Meissner. [5]

There were many such incidentals together with the diary pages which
were typed on _fine_ water-marked paper. This paper was rare in
wartime, occording to Lochner, and would be found in use by only the
highest government officials.  Apparently this is what an unnamed
customer saw when he considered purchasing these documents. He saw
something that could be important. [5] The papers passed through
several hands (as did the Nag Hammadi volumes I mentioned above)
before they came into the possession of Frank E. Johnson who served as
the Military Attache at the American Embassy in Berlin after WW1. [6]
It was Mason who suspected that they were Goebbels diaries and took
them to Lochner, who was the former chief  of the Berlin bureau of the
Associated Press and further established the authenticity of the
documents by considering some of what I have already brought up
here.[6]

Lochner was familiar with Goebbels and the language contained in his
speeches and conversation [7]. He recognized the Goebbels' style and
abusive nature within the body of the diary. The language was the same
as that used in an earlier Goebbels' diary written in the 1920s and
the same gutter language he lapsed into when in conversation. [8] So
for Lochner there were the bundled papers, the stationary, the format,
the style, the characteristic language, and the intimate knowledge of
the people around the diarist that were some of the items that
authenticated the diary for him.

Now we can move on to the chapter called "The Story of the 1945
Goebbels Diaries" by Peter Stadelmayer which is contained in _Final
Entries 1945 The Diaries of Joseph Goebbels_, pp xli. (All page number
reflect the Avon paperback edition.) Mr. Stadelmayer starts out by
saying that up to 8 July 1941 Goebbels wrote his diary by hand. After
that he  used a "stenographer at the Minister's disposal." This
stenographer would take the dication and transcribe them via
typewriter. _Like_ the manuscript diaries they are consistent in
nature. The daily entries deal with the "Military situation" of the
previous day. The handwritten portions were the contents of 1939-1941
Fred Taylor publication. Both of his stenograpers are known, Richard
Otte and Otto Jacobs. They helped with the 1945 Diaries. They recalled
the earlier diaries. They describe what their duties were. [9]

"Towards the end of the war dictated diary entries, by this time were
a considerable pile, together with the black oil-cloth manuscript
diaries, were in the Reich Propaganda Ministry's safes. During the
last months of the war various official agencies in Berlin
"microcopied" their most important files and at this time Richard
Otte, the stenograper who kept the diaries, was ordered to direct and
supervise microcopying of the Goebbels diaries. By this time the
permantent diary stenographer was Otto Jacobs. Richard Otte had been
temperarily seconded in 1938 from the German News Agency (DNB) to the
Reich Ministry for Popular enlightenment and Propaganda where he
joined the Minister's stenographic service and was used to take
minutes at conferences; in 1941 he became 'stenographer at the
Minister's disposal' . . .  . 
   Otto and Jacobs worked in the Goebbels' Ministry until April 1945,
the Sunday on which the Goebbels' family moved into the Reich
Chancellory bunker. Otto Jacobs remembers taking diary dictation and
transcribing it up to 22 April." [9]

So they have the "microcopies" of the diaries. Peter Stadelmayer
mentions the Lochner publication and says that these published
portions were from the actual originals. The 1925/6 diraies have been
published in Germany. The ORIGINALS for the 1942/3 and 1925/6 diaries
are in the Hoover Institution in Stanford, California. [10] The
originals of the 1945 entries were still missing at the time of
publication. 

So there doesn't seem to be much reason to doubt that the diaries are
Goebbels very own.


[1] Lochner, _The Goebbels Diaries_, pp. v
[2] Ibid, pp. v
[3] Ibid, pp vi
[4] Ibid, pp. vii
[5] Ibid, pp viii
[6] Ibid, pp ix
[7] Ibid, pp 24
[8] Ibid, pp 13-20
[9] Roper, _The 1945 Entries_, pp xlii
[10] Idid, pp xliv




Mike Curtis E-mail mcurtis@inetport.com

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