From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  1 09:06:04 PDT 1996
Article: 473293 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,talk.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.president.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,dc.politics,talk.politics.libertarian
Subject: Re: RU-486 is coming - thank you Bill Clinton, but just ....
Date: 1 Oct 1996 00:12:59 GMT
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In <3250467E.3AC@nwark.com> "TJ \"Spark\" Miller jr."
 writes: 
>
>Steven Malcolm Anderson wrote:
>> 
>> In <52ms11$259@usenet78.supernews.com> xanadu@sbt.net (Craig
Chilton)
>> writes:
>> 
>> >>>     That is not extremism, PJ.  It is a recognition of the fact
>> >>> that anti-choicers share a common fault that was exhibited by
>> >>> neo-Nazis and KKK members:  bigotry.  The targets are different.
>> >>> For the neo-Nazis, it was Jews.  For the KKK, it was blacks. 
For
>> >>> the anti-choicers, it is women, and their right to have their
>>                        ^^ ^^ ^^^^^^ ^^^ ^^^^^ ^^^^^ ^^ ^^^^ ^^^^^
>> >>> full range of options just as men do, without being
discriminated
>>     ^^^^ ^^^^^ ^^ ^^^^^^^ ^^^^ ^^ ^^^ ^^^ ^^^^^^^ ^^^^^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> >>> against just because they can become pregnant.  The common
>>     ^^^^^^^ ^^^^ ^^^^^^^ ^^^^ ^^^ ^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^
>> >>> thread linking all of those folks is the serious fault of being
>> >>> guilty of practicing bigotry.
>> 
>>  That next to last sentence sums up _exactly_ what the pro-choice
vs.
>> no-choice debate comes down to.
>> --
>
>So shoving a pair of scissors into a half-born baby's skull is somehow
a
>noble thing, to be guaranteed for any woman who figures that
convenience
>takes precedent over life?

 If women had more access to contraceptives and RU-486, these
relatively late-term abortions would not be so necessary. But _some_
pro-lifers have another agenda. Yes, I _do_ regard a woman pursuing her
own choices as far nobler than forcing her to conform to a stereotyped
role.

>If preventing this type of baby-killing is somehow bigoted, then I
guess
>by your logic, all those Jewish folks who spoke out against the SS
>during WWII were actually bigoted against the "Aryan" Race......
>
>-- 
>x-Signature: T J Miller jr:
>"The worst form of inequality is to make unequal things equal"
>                                 -Aristotle (384-322 BC)
>                     
>Member in Good Standing of:
>Jim Kennemur's "you're a right wing asshole" club.
>(applications now being taken)

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  1 09:23:03 PDT 1996
Article: 320872 of talk.politics.guns
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,soc.culture.usa,alt.president.clinton,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.news-media,alt.journalism,alt.government.abuse,alt.current-events.usa
Subject: Re: Guns don't kill people, Automobiles kill people...
Date: 1 Oct 1996 02:41:00 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In <52prjv$qjs@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com> rolling@ix.netcom.com(william
m hebler ) writes: 
>
>In <325064E2.64E0C2F@skypoint.com> Dash 
writes:
>
>>
>>Many people have written:
>>
>>> "Cars kill by accident; guns kill by design" -- S. Brady
>>
>>When is it that the lovers of this little sound bite are going to
>>realize that the actual issue is not even being addressed. Neither
car
>>nor gun can do anything, unless it is made to do so by a living,
>>breathing and (hopefully) thinking *human being*. 
>>A rock is a rock, neither by accident nor design. But it can kill if
>>used as a weapon (you guessed it), by a *human being*.
>>
>
>They don't care about the issue.  If they cared about the issue, they
>would be arguing for stiffer prison terms and punishments for people
>who commit crimes with or without guns.  If they cared about the issue
>they wouldn't be worrying about taking away my rights to own any damn
>thing I want to own.   They are so misguided.  They are so emotional.
>They actually think their efforts will take weapons out of the hands
of
>people who would use them to commit crimes.  Guns are probably the
>greatest invention of man...they put everyone on equal terms.  I wish
>more people had them.

 If more women had guns, there would be fewer rapists.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  1 11:11:07 PDT 1996
Article: 127262 of soc.culture.african.american
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,soc.culture.usa,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.elections,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.correct,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why DO people vote Democrat?
Date: 1 Oct 1996 00:29:33 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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>  "The Christian Coalition is a growing and responsible group in the
Republican
>  party and I think that is good news. We need groups like the
Christian Coalition
>  working for us."
>  -Bob Dole, (Associated Press newswire, 2-10-96)

 The so-called "Christian Coalition"/"Moral Majority"/ad nauseum is a
CANCER on the Republican party.
 "Government should stay out of people's private lives."
 -Barry Goldwater
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  1 11:55:07 PDT 1996
Article: 54052 of alt.discrimination
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,soc.culture.usa,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.elections,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.correct,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why DO people vote Democrat?
Date: 1 Oct 1996 00:29:33 GMT
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>  "The Christian Coalition is a growing and responsible group in the
Republican
>  party and I think that is good news. We need groups like the
Christian Coalition
>  working for us."
>  -Bob Dole, (Associated Press newswire, 2-10-96)

 The so-called "Christian Coalition"/"Moral Majority"/ad nauseum is a
CANCER on the Republican party.
 "Government should stay out of people's private lives."
 -Barry Goldwater
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  2 09:49:39 PDT 1996
Article: 45507 of alt.politics.white-power
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.politics.correct
Subject: Re: More Black Savagery
Date: 2 Oct 1996 06:15:00 GMT
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Only a racist shit-for-brains gives a shit whether their skin was
black, white or green.

In  ab@washburnu.edu (Adam Blum)
writes: 
>
>CRIME WATCH: Alexandria, Arlington, Falls Church
>
>By Donna Mackie
>
>Thursday, September 26 1996; Page V07 The Washington Post
>
>The following were among crime reports received recently by the
Alexandria
>Police Department.
>
>ASSAULTS
>
>EXECUTIVE AVE., 3800 block, 5:30 p.m. Sept. 17. A man was shot in the
chin
>with a pellet gun as he was leaving a residence. He was treated at
>Alexandria Hospital and released.
>
>ROBBERIES
>
>DUKE ST., 5800 block, 1:11 p.m. Sept. 15. A man in a store robbed an
>employee at gunpoint of cash from a register while a woman acted as a
>lookout at the front of the store.
>
>EISENHOWER AVENUE AND METRO ROAD, 3 p.m. Sept. 11. A woman, 63, walked
>from the Metro station and got into a taxi. A male came up and forced
his
>way into the back seat of the cab, struggled with the woman and tried
>unsuccessfully to steal her purse, then fled with her watch.
>
>GLEBE RD. W., 200 block, 10:05 p.m. Sept. 13. Two men, one who implied
he
>had a gun, robbed an employee in a business of money from a cash
register,
>then fled on foot with two males who were waiting outside.
>
>MOUNT VERNON AVE., 3400 block, 5:47 a.m. Sept. 14. A man who implied
he
>had a gun robbed an employee in a business of money from a cash
register,
>then fled on a bicycle.
>
>THEFTS/BREAK-INS
>
>DUKE ST., 1600 block, 3:30 p.m. Sept. 13 to 7 a.m. Sept. 16. Cash and
a
>computer were stolen from a business entered by forcing a door.
>
>DUKE ST., 1600 block, 6 p.m. Sept. 13 to 11:30 a.m. Sept. 16. A
portable
>CD player was stolen from a business entered by forcing a door.
>
>GADSBY LANE, 2500 block, 4 p.m. Sept. 12 to 10:30 a.m. Sept. 14. A TV
was
>stolen from a residence.
>
>KING ST., 1-100 block, 4 p.m. Sept. 7 to 11 a.m. Sept. 8. Beer was
stolen
>from an unlocked houseboat.
>
>OAKCREST DR., 1700 block, 7:30 p.m. Sept. 11. A wallet and business
>documents were stolen from a residence.
>
>PARK CENTER DR., 2600 block, 8 a.m. Sept. 9 to 3:30 p.m. Sept. 11.
Cash
>and a gift certificate were stolen from a residence.
>
>RIPPON PLACE, 1600 block, 6 p.m. Sept. 3 to 11:50 p.m. Sept. 11.
Jewelry,
>a camera and a portable radio were stolen from a residence.
>
>ROYAL ST. N., 400 block, 1:25 to 1:40 a.m. Sept. 10. A purse, a TV and
>cash were stolen from a residence entered by kicking open a rear door.
>
>SHIRLINGTON RD., 2800 block, 4:30 p.m. Sept. 14 to 7 a.m. Sept. 16. A
>stereo was stolen from a government building.
>
>VIRGINIA AVE., 400 block, 7 a.m. Sept. 11 to 4:30 p.m. Sept. 13. A
bicycle
>was stolen from a garage entered through an unlocked door.
>
>MOTOR VEHICLE THEFTS
>
>ARMISTEAD ST. N., 400 block, 11 p.m. Sept. 10 to 7:30 Sept. 11. A red
1995
>Toyota Corolla was stolen.
>
>COLFAX AVE., 5000 block, 2 to 7 a.m. Sept. 17. A dark blue 1989 Ford
>Bronco was stolen.
>
>DUKE ST., 5000 block, 8 p.m. Sept. 2 to 9 a.m. Sept. 3. Two 1996 Ford
>E-250 U-Haul trucks were stolen.
>
>EISENHOWER AVE., 5000 block, 7:30 a.m. to 3 p.m. Sept. 9. A black and
gray
>1990 Chevrolet Suburban truck was stolen.
>
>HARWICH CT., 5700 block, 6:45 p.m. Sept. 15 to 5:39 a.m. Sept. 16. A
white
>1994 Honda Accord was stolen.
>
>LINCOLNIA RD., 6000 block, 11:26 a.m. Sept. 11. A brown 1983 Datsun
Maxima
>was stolen.
>
>OAKWOOD TER., 600 block, 8 p.m. Sept. 16 to 10 a.m. Sept. 17. A white
1992
>Cadillac DeVille was stolen.
>
>PARK CENTER DR., 3000 block, 7 p.m. Sept. 15 to 9 a.m. Sept. 16. A
white
>1991 Honda Accord LX was stolen.
>
>PICKETT ST. N., 2200 block, 9 p.m. Sept. 15 to 7:15 a.m. Sept. 16. A
jade
>green 1996 Honda Accord was stolen.
>
>PORTNER RD., 1100 block, 8 p.m. Sept. 15 to 7:30 a.m. Sept. 16. A
maroon
>1992 Honda Accord was stolen.
>
>WHITING ST. S., 200 block, 6:30 p.m. Sept. 12 to 9:50 a.m. Sept. 13. A
>burgundy 1996 Acura Integra was stolen.
>
>Arlington
>
>The following are among crime reports received recently by the
Arlington
>County Police Department. For more information, call 703-358-4050.
>
>ROBBERIES
>
>JEFFERSON DAVIS HWY. S., 1200 block, 2:15 p.m. Sept. 15. Two men, one
>armed with a gun, confronted a woman, 44, as she was putting a gym bag
in
>her car, then stole the car, a gray, two-door 1990 BMW 325i.
>
>ASSAULTS
>
>STUART ST. N., 1300 block, 12:20 p.m. Sept. 11. As a youth, 14, was
>walking to school, 12 youths, one armed with a gun, got out of two
>vehicles and confronted him. They asked him if he was a certain
person.
>When he said he was not, they asked him if he knew where that person
could
>be found. No injuries were reported.
>
>ROBBERIES
>
>COLUMBIA PIKE, 2400 block, 8:20 a.m. Sept. 16. A man came up behind a
>woman, 25, and grabbed her purse, then fled in a tan Oldsmobile 98
driven
>by a male.
>
>FERN ST. S., 2700 block, 9:15 p.m. Sept. 12. When a woman, 82,
answered a
>knock at the door of her residence, a man sprayed a chemical substance
in
>her face, forced his way into the residence and fled with the woman's
>purse.
>
>GEORGE MASON DR. S., 1300 block, 1 a.m. Sept. 15. Three males in a
yellow,
>two-door 1988 Honda Prelude blocked the vehicle of a man, 28, who was
>looking for a parking space. Two of the males hit the man and tried to
>take his wallet, then fled when the man shouted for police.
>
>WALTER REED DR. S., 2600 block, 10:55 p.m. Sept. 15. A woman and her
>husband confronted a man as he was putting their bicycles into his
>vehicle. The man displayed a gun and the couple retreated to their
house.
>
>THEFTS/BREAK-INS
>
>ABINGDON ST. N., 700 block, 12:30 to 6:30 p.m. Sept. 12. Shoes were
stolen
>from a residence entered by breaking a pane of glass in the front
door.
>
>GLEBE RD. N., 1-100 block, 4 p.m. Sept. 15 to 4:17 a.m. Sept. 16. A
>computer system, a copy machine, a cell phone and a fax machine were
>stolen from an automotive business entered by forcing the front door.
>
>GREENBRIER ST. S., 800 block. A fax machine was stolen from an
apartment
>building office entered by forcing a door.
>
>LOWELL ST. S., 2400 block, 11:30 p.m. Sept. 14 to 11 a.m. Sept. 15.
Coins
>were stolen from a residence entered through a previously broken
window.
>
>THOMAS ST. N., 100 block, 8:45 a.m. Sept. 16. A man forced his way
into
>the apartment of a female acquaintance. An Arlington man, 29, was
>arrested.
>
>WILSON BLVD., 1500 block, 6 to 7 p.m. Sept. 12. Two lap-top computers
were
>stolen from an office entered with a key.
>
>WILSON BLVD., 2600 block, 6:20 p.m. Sept. 11 to 8:30 a.m. Sept. 12.
Money,
>a TV, a VCR and stereo speakers were stolen from a thrift shop. Also
>reported stolen was a brown/tan 1985 Chevrolet van.
>
>WILSON BLVD., 3200 block, 8:15 to 9:45 p.m. Sept. 11. A store was
entered
>by forcing a door. Nothing was reported missing.
>
>WOLFE ST. S., 1100 block, 9:15 p.m. Sept. 11 to 8:07 a.m. Sept. 12. A
TV
>was stolen from a residence entered by forcing a rear door.
>
>10TH ST. N., 5100 block, 6:45 a.m. Sept. 12 to 7:30 a.m. Sept. 13.
Jewelry
>was stolen from a residence entered by forcing a rear door.
>
>13TH RD. S., 1600 block, 10 p.m. Sept. 13 to 7 a.m. Sept. 14. A
computer
>and monitor, a printer and a fax machine were stolen from a church.
>
>Falls Church
>
>The following were among the crime reports received recently by the
Falls
>Church Police Department. For more information, call 703-241-5004.
>
>KIDNAPPINGS
>
>WASHINGTON ST. S., 400 block, 1:30 a.m. Sept. 15. During an
altercation at
>a pizza restaurant, two men assaulted a man, pointed a gun to his head
and
>handcuffed him.
>
>ASSAULTS
>
>WASHINGTON ST. S., 400 block, 1:30 a.m. Sept. 15. Two men at a pizza
>restaurant accused each other of assault. A Vienna man, 30, was
arrested
>and charged with impersonating a police officer.
>
>THEFTS/BREAK-INS
>
>BROAD ST. E., 100 block, 6:05 p.m. Sept. 16 to 7:55 a.m. Sept. 17. A
>notebook computer and other property were stolen from a business
entered
>by forcing a side door.
>
>BROAD ST. E., 1000 block, July 2 to Aug. 1. A 1996 Ford Escort was
stolen
>from a car dealership.
>
>BROAD ST. W., 200 block, 9 a.m. Sept. 13. A gas grill and two food
>preparation tables were stolen from a restaurant kitchen.
>
>BROAD ST. W., 1100 block, 6 p.m. Sept. 9 to 7 a.m. Sept. 10. An
attempt
>was made to enter an auto parts business by forcing the
double-cylinder
>deadbolt door lock.
>
>FOWLER ST., 1000 block, 6 p.m. Sept. 8 to 9 a.m. Sept. 11. A stereo
was
>stolen from a truck.
>
>GEORGE MASON RD. W., 200 block, 11 p.m. Sept. 11 to 7:39 a.m. Sept.
12. A
>stereo and a purse were stolen from a vehicle entered by breaking a
>window.
>
>GREENWAY BLVD. W., 100 block, 12:01 to 4:16 a.m. Sept. 12. A stereo
and a
>nylon bag containing five diskettes were stolen from a locked car.
>
>GREENWAY BLVD. W., 100 block, 11 p.m. Sept. 11 to 4:20 a.m. Sept. 12.
A
>stereo was stolen from a car entered by breaking a window, and a
stereo
>and speakers were stolen from a truck entered by breaking a window.
>
>GREENWAY BLVD. W., 200 block, 9 p.m. Sept. 11 to noon Sept. 12. A CD
>player was stolen from a vehicle entered by breaking a window.
>
>HAYCOCK RD., 100 block, 6 p.m. Sept. 14 to 9 a.m. Sept. 15. A bicycle
was
>stolen.
>
>HILLWOOD AVE., 1-100 block, 12:01 a.m. Sept. 10 to 10:16 a.m. Sept.
11.
>Four tires and wheels were taken from two vehicles at a taxi company.
>
>PARK AVE., 200 block, 5 p.m. Sept. 13 to 10:30 a.m. Sept. 14. A 1996
Ford
>Ranger parked at an office building was stolen. It was recovered Sept.
16
>at the same location.
>
>WASHINGTON ST. N., 300 block, 10 a.m. Sept. 16. A job log and a
shipping
>log were stolen from an office in an office building.
>
>WASHINGTON ST. S., 800 block, Aug. 28 to Sept. 6. Two unauthorized
>withdrawals were made from an automated teller machine at a
convenience
>store.
>
>WESTMORELAND RD. W., 100 block, 6:30 p.m. Sept. 11 to 3:55 a.m. Sept.
12.
>A stereo and a speaker were stolen from a locked truck.
>
>WILSON BLVD., 6700 block, 12:12 a.m. Sept. 17. Gas was stolen from a
gas
>station.
>
>VANDALISM
>
>ELLISON ST., 900 block, 10 p.m. Sept. 14 to 7 a.m. Sept. 15. Four
tires on
>a car were slashed.
>
>ELLISON ST., 900 block, 1 to 10 a.m. Sept. 16. A tire of a vehicle was
>punctured.
>
>LEESBURG PIKE, 7100 block, 10:30 a.m. to noon Sept. 17. A rear plastic
>convertible top of a car was slashed.
>
>PARK AVE., 100 block, 7 p.m. Sept. 12 to 9 a.m. Sept. 13. A wooden
>staircase in an office building was damaged.
>
>Copyright 1996 The Washington Post Company
>
>Back to the top

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  2 10:34:27 PDT 1996
Article: 473842 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!noc.van.hookup.net!laslo.netnet.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-dc-5.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,talk.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.president.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,dc.politics,tal
Subject: Re: End Abortion with Birth Control and Sex Education
Date: 2 Oct 1996 07:44:40 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <52t6h8$goe@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com>
References:  <525lki$d81@news71.supernews.com> 
NNTP-Posting-Host: hay-ca7-33.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Oct 02  2:44:40 AM CDT 1996
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In  whitroth@gagme.wwa.com (mark)
writes: 
>
>In article <3248CB2C.4B5A@ns.net>, Melanie  wrote:
>> Brian E. Seppanen wrote:

 ...and you believe that the
>government should be Really Big Government, and want to institute Big
>Brother, so the Government can look into every bedroom, and make sure 
>that only people with licenses to fuck, excuse me, state-chartered
>marriages, are having sex....

 Get Big Brother OUT of our bedrooms!!!!

>
>    mark "it's not like the urge to reproduce as soon as we could
>                was hard-wired into our genes, nah, that would only
>                be true if evolution was true...."

 I, for one, have no urge to reproduce at all. All of my sexual urges
are gratified without any reproduction at all. Thank Goddess.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  2 10:34:28 PDT 1996
Article: 474132 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!nnrp.info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.activism,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.society.conservatism,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.reform,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,talk.politics.guns,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,soc.women,talk.politics.theory
Subject: Re: "Entschuldiger" Milt-  Wow! the suction had to be at least 500 bar!
Date: 2 Oct 1996 06:30:54 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <52t26u$q3o@dfw-ixnews10.ix.netcom.com>
References: <32461DD0.7AC5@computek.net> <52iepg$qk9@dfw-ixnews2.ix.netcom.com>  <52n8sr$8e3@newsgate.sps.mot.com> <324F34FB.5A13@computek.net>  <32508529.4979@nwark.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hay-ca7-33.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Oct 02  1:30:54 AM CDT 1996
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.misc:474132 alt.politics.usa.republican:294744 alt.activism:79313 alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich:84679 alt.society.conservatism:54097 alt.politics.correct:141666 alt.politics.reform:101046 alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater:41319 talk.politics.guns:321303 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:387649 alt.politics.clinton:303983 alt.politics.democrats.d:129715 soc.women:119218 talk.politics.theory:83389

In <32508529.4979@nwark.com> "TJ \"Spark\" Miller jr."
 writes: 
>
>Milt wrote:

>> Your "right-thinking, decent people are always trying to censor
>> others, while claiming free speech on anything they want to say.

 I, for one, am against censorship, period. As well as gun control.

>Uh, Milt? you're drooling on your keyboard there, bud.....
>
>> After
>> all, it wasn't libs who tried to kill "Playboy" and "penthouse"...
>
>No, they just want our kids to have easier access to it.

 I notice that both censors and gun-controllers are always using
"protect the children" as a pretext for undermining the First and
Second Amendment rights of adults. 

>-- 
>x-Signature: T J Miller jr:
>"The worst form of inequality is to make unequal things equal"
>                                 -Aristotle (384-322 BC)
>                     
>Member in Good Standing of:
>Jim Kennemur's "you're a right wing asshole" club.
>(applications now being taken)

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  2 10:34:29 PDT 1996
Article: 474138 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.guns,soc.culture.usa,free.lunch.no-such-thing,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.usa,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.perot,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.greens,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.elections,alt.politics.economics,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.flame.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.ronald-reagan,alt.fan.noam-chomsky,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.fan.dan-quayle
Subject: Re: Why NRA fought to cut funding for the CDC
Date: 2 Oct 1996 08:40:38 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <52t9q6$fll@dfw-ixnews6.ix.netcom.com>
References: <323ed3e3.2096548@news.netheaven.com>  <323F2AC0.4A2E@computek.net> <32402ad1.20660406@news.netheaven.com> <32436343.E63@cyberstation.net> <32437BEB.1F09@computek.net> <32459E7E.6EB2@provide.net> <5242bg$gsc_002@nuts.nwu.edu> <3245CD9E.5482@vegas.infi.net> <524jtf$fno_003@nuts.nwu.edu> <324819F9.7FB8@provide.net>  <52qhkk$9jn@news.snowcrest.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hay-ca7-33.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Oct 02  3:40:38 AM CDT 1996
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.misc:474138 talk.politics.libertarian:129371 talk.politics.guns:321307 soc.culture.usa:95052 alt.politics.usa.republican:294755 alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich:84681 alt.politics.usa.misc:116171 alt.politics.usa.constitution:94085 alt.politics.usa.congress:69252 alt.politics.reform:101051 alt.politics.radical-left:123413 alt.politics.perot:57707 alt.politics.libertarian:217085 alt.politics.greens:17656 alt.politics.elections:79806 alt.politics.economics:73110 alt.politics.democrats.d:129720 alt.politics.correct:141669 alt.politics.clinton:303987 alt.impeach.clinton:61618 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:387657 alt.fan.ronald-reagan:31332 alt.fan.noam-chomsky:17242 alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy:43403 alt.fan.dan-quayle:73401

In <52qhkk$9jn@news.snowcrest.net> zepp@snowcrest.net (Zepp) polluted
the cyberspace with this: 

>Snip paranoid gun rant.

 Typical gun control lobby rhetoric. You must be "paranoid" if you
don't trust government with a monopoly on guns. "He loved Big Brother."


-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  2 11:28:53 PDT 1996
Article: 321303 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!nnrp.info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.activism,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.society.conservatism,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.reform,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,talk.politics.guns,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,soc.women,talk.politics.theory
Subject: Re: "Entschuldiger" Milt-  Wow! the suction had to be at least 500 bar!
Date: 2 Oct 1996 06:30:54 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 36
Message-ID: <52t26u$q3o@dfw-ixnews10.ix.netcom.com>
References: <32461DD0.7AC5@computek.net> <52iepg$qk9@dfw-ixnews2.ix.netcom.com>  <52n8sr$8e3@newsgate.sps.mot.com> <324F34FB.5A13@computek.net>  <32508529.4979@nwark.com>
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X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Oct 02  1:30:54 AM CDT 1996
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.misc:474132 alt.politics.usa.republican:294744 alt.activism:79313 alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich:84679 alt.society.conservatism:54097 alt.politics.correct:141666 alt.politics.reform:101046 alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater:41319 talk.politics.guns:321303 alt.fan.rush-limbaugh:387649 alt.politics.clinton:303983 alt.politics.democrats.d:129715 soc.women:119218 talk.politics.theory:83389

In <32508529.4979@nwark.com> "TJ \"Spark\" Miller jr."
 writes: 
>
>Milt wrote:

>> Your "right-thinking, decent people are always trying to censor
>> others, while claiming free speech on anything they want to say.

 I, for one, am against censorship, period. As well as gun control.

>Uh, Milt? you're drooling on your keyboard there, bud.....
>
>> After
>> all, it wasn't libs who tried to kill "Playboy" and "penthouse"...
>
>No, they just want our kids to have easier access to it.

 I notice that both censors and gun-controllers are always using
"protect the children" as a pretext for undermining the First and
Second Amendment rights of adults. 

>-- 
>x-Signature: T J Miller jr:
>"The worst form of inequality is to make unequal things equal"
>                                 -Aristotle (384-322 BC)
>                     
>Member in Good Standing of:
>Jim Kennemur's "you're a right wing asshole" club.
>(applications now being taken)

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  2 11:28:54 PDT 1996
Article: 321307 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.guns,soc.culture.usa,free.lunch.no-such-thing,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.usa,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.perot,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.greens,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.elections,alt.politics.economics,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.flame.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.ronald-reagan,alt.fan.noam-chomsky,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.fan.dan-quayle
Subject: Re: Why NRA fought to cut funding for the CDC
Date: 2 Oct 1996 08:40:38 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 15
Message-ID: <52t9q6$fll@dfw-ixnews6.ix.netcom.com>
References: <323ed3e3.2096548@news.netheaven.com>  <323F2AC0.4A2E@computek.net> <32402ad1.20660406@news.netheaven.com> <32436343.E63@cyberstation.net> <32437BEB.1F09@computek.net> <32459E7E.6EB2@provide.net> <5242bg$gsc_002@nuts.nwu.edu> <3245CD9E.5482@vegas.infi.net> <524jtf$fno_003@nuts.nwu.edu> <324819F9.7FB8@provide.net>  <52qhkk$9jn@news.snowcrest.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hay-ca7-33.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Oct 02  3:40:38 AM CDT 1996
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In <52qhkk$9jn@news.snowcrest.net> zepp@snowcrest.net (Zepp) polluted
the cyberspace with this: 

>Snip paranoid gun rant.

 Typical gun control lobby rhetoric. You must be "paranoid" if you
don't trust government with a monopoly on guns. "He loved Big Brother."


-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  2 11:28:55 PDT 1996
Article: 321308 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!portc01.blue.aol.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,soc.culture.usa,alt.president.clinton,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.news-media,alt.journalism,alt.government.abuse,alt.current-events.usa
Subject: Re: Guns don't kill people, Automobiles kill people...
Date: 2 Oct 1996 09:19:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 30
Message-ID: <52tc3d$rm@dfw-ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>
References: <4urdfa$j9f@dailyplanet.wam.umd.edu> <3249950C.20F7@itl.net> <52noci$qej@dfw-ixnews6.ix.netcom.com> <325064E2.64E0C2F@skypoint.com> <52r7pg$4kk@crl11.crl.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hay-ca7-33.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Wed Oct 02  4:19:41 AM CDT 1996
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca talk.politics.guns:321308 soc.culture.usa:95053 alt.president.clinton:100798 alt.politics.usa.republican:294756 alt.politics.usa.misc:116172 alt.politics.usa.constitution:94086 alt.politics.usa.congress:69253 alt.politics.reform:101052 alt.politics.libertarian:217086 alt.politics.democrats.d:129721 alt.politics.correct:141670 alt.politics.clinton:303988 alt.news-media:30945 alt.journalism:56143 alt.current-events.usa:30842

In <52r7pg$4kk@crl11.crl.com> stratos@crl.com (Steve D. Fischer)
writes: 
>
>In article <325064E2.64E0C2F@skypoint.com>,
>Dash   wrote:
>>Many people have written:
>>
>>> "Cars kill by accident; guns kill by design" -- S. Brady
>>
>>When is it that the lovers of this little sound bite are going to
>>realize that the actual issue is not even being addressed. Neither
car
>>nor gun can do anything, unless it is made to do so by a living,
>>breathing and (hopefully) thinking *human being*. 
>>A rock is a rock, neither by accident nor design. But it can kill if
>>used as a weapon (you guessed it), by a *human being*.
>
>      So what if guns kill by design?  So what?  Some people deserve
>to be killed (self-defense).  Guns fulfill that need nicely.

 Exactly. Gun controllers don't believe in self-defense. The gun
control lobby wants everybody to just turn the other cheek, lie down
and be raped.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct  3 11:43:06 PDT 1996
Article: 474549 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!hookup!nntp-hub2.barrnet.net!news.sgi.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,talk.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.president.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich
Subject: Re: RU-486 is coming - thank you Bill Clinton, but just ....
Date: 3 Oct 1996 05:03:34 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 40
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References: <52n5bq$e8m@newsgate.sps.mot.com> <3250090f.8212276@nntp.ix.netcom.com> <325227A6.2B4C@cdsnet.net> <3252A037.7DA8@ianet.net>
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In <3252A037.7DA8@ianet.net> Kenneth Gore  writes: 
>
>Erik & Angela wrote:
>> 
>> >
>> > So, work to improve access to birth control.  Or work to remove
some of
>> > the reasons women seek abortions.
>> >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> > ---------------
>> > Larry McKnight
>> > (this space unintentionally left blank.....
>> 
>> Gimme a break.  This is an old and idiotic argument.  Birth control
is
>> more available in this country than friggin Big Mac.
>> 
>> Any drug store carries condoms...  Planned Parenthood gives them
away
>> for free...

 I find it interesting that PP is so often vilified by pro-lifers
(almost as much the NRA [they must be doing _something_ right!] is by
the gun control lobby)* as evil abortion-promoters -- and yet by
promoting contraception, they are obviously _preventing_ abortions.
Could it be that it's contraception that some of these pro-lifers
really hate? If abortion is banned, can contraception be far behind?

* Yes, I'm pro-choice on _both_ issues, guns _and_ abortion! 

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct  3 11:43:07 PDT 1996
Article: 474599 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,talk.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.president.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,dc.politics,ta
Subject: Re: RU-486 is coming - thank you Bill Clinton, but just ....
Date: 3 Oct 1996 04:42:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In <52u1mn$4te@kirin.wwa.com> kbrowne@wwa.com (keith) writes: 
>
>In article <52tb1a$egn@usenet78.supernews.com>, xanadu@sbt.net says...
>>
>>careyb@netaxs.com (Brian Carey) wrote:
>
>>>Craig Chilton (xanadu@sbt.net) wrote:
>>>: 
>>>: >      This is scary.  Plain and simple.
>>>: 
>>>:      NOT scary.  Not at ALL scary.  No more "scary" than it is to
>>>: take an aspirin to eliminate an unwanted headache.
>>
>>>Hmmmm... comparing an unborn baby to a headache?  The barbarism of
the
>>>pro-death crowd never ceases to amaze me.
>>
>>     That's okay.  Because the capability of the anti-choice
>>crowd to constantly and fanatically attempt to ascribe value to
>>something that does yet HAVE any worth never ceases to amaze we
>>who are pro-choice humanitarians, either.
>
> Has no worth. How Hitler of you. Tell you what. Take a survey of
women
>who are less than 3 months pregnant and ask them if the embryo has no
worth.

 Obviously, it has worth _to them_. If they want the child, that is.
Otherwise, they seek abortions. Are they Hitlers if they do so?

>> You, who would choose
>>to uncompassionately destroy the life options of countless
>>millions of women in favor of defending something does not yet
>>even exist.
>
>  That's right. child bearing is destroying women. Goddammit!!!

 So, women have a _duty_ to bear children, want them or not? Are _you_
willing to adopt all the unwanted babies?

>> People just don't GET more callous and irrational than THAT.
>
> Sure they do. They terminate a potential life on the matter of
convenience.

 What if the government forced _you_ to give up _your_ career to
satisfy some agenda you didn't agree with, say, "animal rights"? Or
what if they forced you to be nothing but a sperm donor for nine months
or the rest of your life, because your "natural role" is to reproduce? 
"Inconvenient", huh?

>
>
>keith 
>
>>      --Craig Chilton     xanadu@sbt.net
>>
>

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Fri Oct  4 07:45:16 PDT 1996
Article: 95307 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Assholes who "pretend" to be Libertarian, just to recommend we vote for statists because they can "win".
Date: 3 Oct 1996 21:49:57 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In <52slg8$sme@camel1.mindspring.com> bradbva@chv.mindspring.com (Brad
Barnhill) writes: 
>
>deano@primenet.com (deano) wrote:

>>Myself, I would rather not sit out the
>>election and let Bill Clinton appoint another crop of activist 
                                                        ^^^^^^^^
liberal
>>judges,

 You've been sold some prime real estate in Antarctica on that one. The
attack on "activist judges" was invented by the ANTI-individual,
"pro-family", "Moral Majority", totalitarian element in the Republican
party to smear judges like William O. Douglas, Hugo Black, Harry
Blackmun, John Paul Stevens, etc., for upholding our individual
Constitutional rights, such as privacy and free speech. The
totalitarians want the government to ban homosexuality, abortion,
contraception, pornography, etc., and they don't want the courts to
stand in the way of that agenda. They want the Prez to appoint only
jerks like that scumbag Robert Bork who will sit on their hands and say
"oh, well, you don't really have a right to privacy" or "well, the
First Amendment doesn't really protect pornography." The attack on
"judicial activism" is totally ANTI-libertarian. (See Stephen Macedo's
book "The New Right vs. The Constitution" for info on that scam.)

 hand the  U.S. military over to the U.N., take huge chunks of
>>land and resources as trophies for the hollywood ecology crowd, place
>>unfunded mandates on employers that will drive business out of the
>>country, socialize the health care industry, 'fix' that little
slip-up
>>that ended the 'right' to endless welfare, and escalate the liberal's
>>war on gun owners, to name just a tiny  few.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Fri Oct  4 07:45:17 PDT 1996
Article: 95319 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Turncoat "libertarians" are better off voting for Bill than for Bob (if they can't do the right thing)
Date: 3 Oct 1996 22:38:23 GMT
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In  msch19@mail.idt.net
(Mike Schneider) writes: 

> Whatever you say about
>Dornan, he's not an "establishment" republican like Dole,

 Dornan is a totalitarian scumbag who wants Big Brother in our
bedrooms. He's no more "libertarian" than Josef Stalin.
 
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 10:28:54 PDT 1996
Article: 95612 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Assholes who "pretend" to be Libertarian, just to recommend we vote for statists because they can "win".
Date: 4 Oct 1996 19:48:21 GMT
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In <3254DBCF.22E2@aa.net> Lucas Swineford  writes: 
>
>Max Kennedy wrote:
>> 
>> bradbva@chv.mindspring.com (Brad Barnhill) wrote:
>> 
>> >This is _nothing_ compared to what we would gain from getting 15%
to
>> >20% of the vote:  A party we would all be proud of, and a party
which
>> >the media can no longer ignore.
>> 
>> 15-20% of the vote is LOSING.
>> 
>> For the Socialis, err Democrats, 15-20% of the vote is WINNING.
>
>	I agree that the Democrats will benefit if Libertarians vote
>Libertarian in this election.  The Libertarian cause would be better
off
>with a Republican victory than with a Democratic victory.  15-20% of
the
>vote will not make the Libertarian party "a party which the media can
no
>longer ignore."  The media can, will, and routinely does ignore
>whatever  the hell they want to ignore.  A Democratic victory means 4
>more years of the media preaching socialist propaganda by pretending
to
>objectively report the administration's latest activities.  If Clinton
>wants an anti-porn law, the media will find a study by some "experts"
>who say that porn makes men rape.

 The Reagan crowd did that one already. Remember the Meese Committee?

  If Clinton wants to tax sports cars,
>the media will discuss some government statistic about global warming.
>If Clinton wants to raise taxes and set up government "retraining"
>centers, then they will find some "economist" who says that people
need
>retraining for the new "global economy".  If Clinton wants to make
>tabacco sales illegal, then CNN will show you some "random" "factoid"
>about how millions of people are "killed" by tabacco each year.

 Gun control, too. They lie about guns all the time.

  If the
>Republicans win, the media will be left with reporting the Republican
>administration's activities by talking about people protesting Dole's
>policies and by letting wacko leftists shout their drivel on TV. 
>Summary - if Clinton wins, the media goes on defense; if Dole wins,
the
>media goes on offense.  The media sucks either way, but if Dole wins,
we
>know the media will not be getting what they want.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 10:28:55 PDT 1996
Article: 95631 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Why this Libertarian will vote Republican in November
Date: 4 Oct 1996 20:03:47 GMT
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In  weedeatr@netcom.com (Weed Eater
(munch munch)) writes: 


>All that said I will vote Libertarian for senate, but that is because
I 
>am represented by Jesse Helms and thus have no choice :).

 Good. Because Jesse Helms is a despicable totalitarian scumbag.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 10:28:56 PDT 1996
Article: 95632 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,soc.culture.usa,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.elections,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.president.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why DO people vote Democrat?
Date: 4 Oct 1996 22:16:55 GMT
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>>: "In all of these nearly 18 years that I have had the pleasure of 
>>: my association with Bob Dole, I have never known Bob to give even
>>: a hint of breaking his word, because if ever there was a man in 
>>: the U.S. Senate for whom we knew his word is his bond, that is 
>>: Bob Dole." 
>>:      -- Nebraska Sen. James Exon (Congressional Record, 6/11/96)   

 James Exon is the jerk who wants to censor the net.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 10:28:56 PDT 1996
Article: 95633 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Assholes who "pretend" to be Libertarian, just to recommend we vote for statists because they can "win".
Date: 4 Oct 1996 21:51:32 GMT
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In <533mb2$kae@nnrp1.news.primenet.com> deano@primenet.com (deano)
writes: 
>
>sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote:

>> You've been sold some prime real estate in Antarctica on that one.
The
>>attack on "activist judges" was invented by the ANTI-individual,
>>"pro-family", "Moral Majority", totalitarian element in the
Republican
>>party to smear judges like William O. Douglas, Hugo Black, Harry
>>Blackmun, John Paul Stevens, etc., for upholding our individual
>>Constitutional rights, such as privacy and free speech. The
>>totalitarians want the government to ban homosexuality, abortion,
>>contraception, pornography, etc., and they don't want the courts to
>>stand in the way of that agenda. They want the Prez to appoint only
>>jerks like that scumbag Robert Bork who will sit on their hands and
say
>>"oh, well, you don't really have a right to privacy" or "well, the
>>First Amendment doesn't really protect pornography." The attack on
>>"judicial activism" is totally ANTI-libertarian. (See Stephen
Macedo's
>>book "The New Right vs. The Constitution" for info on that scam.)
>
>
>   Activist judges of any stripe are an abomination to a nation of
>laws. Robert Bork was cast out, quite fortunately since he does not
>seem to understand that the Constitution sets forth and enumerates the
>limited powers of the federal government and that all other rights are
>reserved to the states and to the people and are not 'found' there.

 He's a totalitarian scumbag who denies individual rights.
 The Tenth Amendment: "The powers not delegated to the United States by
the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to
the States respectively, _or to the people_."
 The Ninth Amendment: "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain
rights, shall _not_ be construed to deny or disparage others retained
by _the people_."
 The Second Amendment: "A well-regulated militia, being necessary to
the security of a _free_ [IOW, not socialist] State, the right of _the
people_ to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
 (emphasis mine)
 "States' rights" is a fraud. Neither state nor federal governments
have rights, only _delegated_ and stringently _limited_ powers. Only
"the people" _as individuals_ have rights. State legislatures do not
own us. We are not their property.  
 
>  Judges who go beyond the intent of the law are usurping the powers
>of the legislative branch and thereby thwarting the (representative)
>will of the people.

 The will of the majority _should_ be thwarted whenever it infringes on
individual rights.

 Bork was thrown out on idealogical grounds, but
>since that time judicial activism doesn't seem to be a disqualifying
>factor in Senate confirmations anymore.
>   In cautioning against allowing Clinton another term I mentioned
>'activist liberal judges', because the press does not campaign against
>them and they seldom fail confirmation on idealogical grounds.
>Although an 'activist conservative judge' might be just as bad, the
>danger of them being confirmed would be much less. Republicans are
>lucky if they can get a 'constitutionalist' confirmed, but you won't
>see any of them appointed by Clinton.
>   This drift toward rule by a judiciary unfettered by the intentions
>of the Constitution, the other branches of government, or the people
>is by no means good for libertarianism.

 You think it's good for libertarianism for us to accept the idea that
we are the property of state legislatures?

 In fact, it may be that the
>only influence a lifetime appointed Justice is really swayed by is the
>desire to please the press and see good things said about them in the
>media.
>    When was the last time you heard an activist liberal judge come
>down in favor of individual property rights against the demands of
>state, or the 'public good', or the 'needs of the many'?

 When was the last time you heard a Reaganoid appointee strike down a
gun control law?

>- deano
>     ----------------------------------------------------------
>     A faint blueish haze rises in the distance. You hear a
>     deep and powerful sound, long forgotten. It suddenly grows
>     until the earth trembles.
>         Look! The next exit! It's Deano's MotorHead Page!
>     ----------------------------------------------------------
>            http://www.primenet.com/~deano/motorh.html
>                        update: 09/17/96
>

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 10:28:57 PDT 1996
Article: 95743 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.nstn.ca!newsflash.concordia.ca!newsfeed.pitt.edu!news.duq.edu!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!netnews.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Turncoat "libertarians" are better off voting for Bill than for Bob (if they can't do the right thing)
Date: 5 Oct 1996 03:51:20 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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References: <52fb9h$su0@pulm1.accessone.com>   <324e911f.0@dns2.abcs.com> <52pgr6$kao@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>  <52qvb6$cur@camel0.mindspring.com> <52rphv$r25@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>  <531f8v$42l@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com> 
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In  msch19@mail.idt.net
(Mike Schneider) writes: 
>
>In article <531f8v$42l@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com>,
sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote:
>
>> In 
msch19@mail.idt.net
>> (Mike Schneider) writes: 
>> 
>> > Whatever you say about
>> >Dornan, he's not an "establishment" republican like Dole,
>> 
>>  Dornan is a totalitarian scumbag who wants Big Brother in our
>> bedrooms. He's no more "libertarian" than Josef Stalin.
>
>
>
>   Perhaps, but he's LESS of a totalitarian scumbag than either
Clinton or Dole,

 No, he isn't.

 and he positively LOATHES Clinton.

 Stalin and Hitler fought also.


-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 10:28:58 PDT 1996
Article: 95755 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netnews.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Assholes who "pretend" to be Libertarian, just to recommend we vote for statists because they can "win".
Date: 5 Oct 1996 03:58:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 57
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In  msch19@mail.idt.net
(Mike Schneider) writes: 
>
>In article <531ce5$dm1@dfw-ixnews3.ix.netcom.com>,
sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote:
>
>> totalitarians want the government to ban homosexuality, abortion,
>> contraception, pornography, etc., and they don't want the courts to
>> stand in the way of that agenda. They want the Prez to appoint only
>> jerks like that scumbag Robert Bork who will sit on their hands and
say
>> "oh, well, you don't really have a right to privacy" or "well, the
>> First Amendment doesn't really protect pornography." The attack on
>> "judicial activism" is totally ANTI-libertarian. (See Stephen
Macedo's
>> book "The New Right vs. The Constitution" for info on that scam.)
>
>
>
>   Bork has also been recorded opining that he didn't think the 2nd
Amendment didn't "really" apply to handgun bans.
>
>   Jerk.

 Yup.

>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
++++
>|  YOU LIVE IN A DICTATORSHIP. THE VOTE IS RIGGED. BECOME A
POLL-WATCHER. |
>|  Vote fraud investigations site:
http://www.networkusa.org/index.shtml. |
>|  Votescam home page: http://www.parascope.com/mx/votescam.htm
BROWSE'M. |
>|  YOU HAVE 30 DAYS TO DENY THE "VOTER'S NEWS SERVICE" ANOTHER
RIGGING!!! |
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
++++
>|  SKELETON CLOSET: http://www.realchange.org/ "All the dirt on all
the   |
>|  candidates - Because character DOES matter". Libertarian HARRY
BROWNE  |
>|  the only CLEAN candidate in the race!
http://www.harrybrowne96.org/.   |
>|  web poll:
http://pathfinder.com/cgi-bin/GDML/gdmldb?VirtualElection.   |
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
++++
>         
>READ IT.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 10:28:59 PDT 1996
Article: 95771 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netnews.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Turncoat "libertarians" are better off voting for Bill than for Bob (if they can't do the right thing)
Date: 5 Oct 1996 03:54:41 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In  msch19@mail.idt.net
(Mike Schneider) writes: 
>
>In article <531f8v$42l@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com>,
sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote:
>
>> In 
msch19@mail.idt.net
>> (Mike Schneider) writes: 
>> 
>> > Whatever you say about
>> >Dornan, he's not an "establishment" republican like Dole,
>> 
>>  Dornan is a totalitarian scumbag who wants Big Brother in our
>> bedrooms. He's no more "libertarian" than Josef Stalin.
>
>
>
>   Perhaps, but he's LESS of a totalitarian scumbag than either
Clinton or Dole,

 No, he's not.

 and he positively LOATHES Clinton.

 Stalin fought Hitler in World War II.


-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 11:10:56 PDT 1996
Article: 475791 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!nnrp.info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,talk.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.president.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa,talk.politics.misc,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,dc.politics,ta
Subject: Re: RU-486 is coming - thank you Bill Clinton, but just ....
Date: 4 Oct 1996 22:56:52 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In <530jqo$rs6@kirin.wwa.com> kbrowne@wwa.com (keith) writes: 
>
>In article <52vg81$47c@sjx-ixn2.ix.netcom.com>, sma4@ix.netcom.co
says...
>>
>>In <52u1mn$4te@kirin.wwa.com> kbrowne@wwa.com (keith) writes: 
>>>
>>>In article <52tb1a$egn@usenet78.supernews.com>, xanadu@sbt.net
says...
>>>>
>>>>careyb@netaxs.com (Brian Carey) wrote:
>>>
>>>>>Craig Chilton (xanadu@sbt.net) wrote:
>>>>>: 
>>>>>: >      This is scary.  Plain and simple.
>>>>>: 
>>>>>:      NOT scary.  Not at ALL scary.  No more "scary" than it is
	to
>>>>>: take an aspirin to eliminate an unwanted headache.
>>>>
>>>>>Hmmmm... comparing an unborn baby to a headache?  The barbarism of
>>the
>>>>>pro-death crowd never ceases to amaze me.
>>>>
>>>>     That's okay.  Because the capability of the anti-choice
>>>>crowd to constantly and fanatically attempt to ascribe value to
>>>>something that does yet HAVE any worth never ceases to amaze we
>>>>who are pro-choice humanitarians, either.
>>>
>>> Has no worth. How Hitler of you. Tell you what. Take a survey of
>>women
>>>who are less than 3 months pregnant and ask them if the embryo has
no
>>worth.
>>
>> Obviously, it has worth _to them_. If they want the child, that is.
>>Otherwise, they seek abortions. Are they Hitlers if they do so?
>>
> 
> The Hitler statement refers to the prior poster's statement that the
> beginning of a life has no worth unless its carrier says so. It was
not
> reflecting on the woman who chooses to get one.
> 
> You know this could on & on & on ad infinitum. You're not talking to
a
>'let's end all abortions' position. However, it does occur to me that
> 1 1/2 million abortions a year has a allowed for a somewhat 'casual'
> attitude regarding abortions. 

 1 1/2 million abortions a year is a lot of abortions. It would also be
a lot of adoptions. 

> Personally, if you ask if I feel it's a womans right to choose, I
would say
> yes. If you asked if I felt abortion is right, I'd say no 95%+ of the
time.
>
>>>> You, who would choose
>>>>to uncompassionately destroy the life options of countless
>>>>millions of women in favor of defending something does not yet
>>>>even exist.
>>>
>>>  That's right. child bearing is destroying women. Goddammit!!!
>>
>> So, women have a _duty_ to bear children, want them or not? Are
_you_
>>willing to adopt all the unwanted babies?
>>
> 
> Look, an embryo exists. It doesn't ask 'Can I exist?' or 'Should I
exist?'
> It says alot about our culture when you say women who don't 'want
them'.
> I understand this is the case, but you have a hard making a case that
> this is the 'triumph' of humanity.

 I don't regard a woman as less human or less feminine if she doesn't
want children.

> You might want to ask your parents if you came at an 'opportune'
time.
> I know I didn't. And in hindsight to them my mother's pregnancy was
part
> of the experience of 'life'. 
>
>>>> People just don't GET more callous and irrational than THAT.
>>>
>>> Sure they do. They terminate a potential life on the matter of
>>convenience.
>>
>> What if the government forced _you_ to give up _your_ career to
>>satisfy some agenda you didn't agree with, say, "animal rights"? 
>>Or what if they forced you to be nothing but a sperm donor for nine
months
>>or the rest of your life, because your "natural role" is to
reproduce? 
>>"Inconvenient", huh?
>>
>  
> If there is mutual agreement to sex and a woman doesn't want to get 
> pregnant, there are ways to avoid it.

 I note that the noisiest pro-lifers are not too noisy about promoting
effective contraception. Quite the opposite. 

 One thing that really strikes me is
> that I know a lot of couples who want to get pregnant, and it is a
big
> deal. And they can't seem to. On the other hand you have people who
can
> pregnant without trying or caring and it means little to them. Quite
a
> dichotomy.
>
>
>keith
>

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 11:10:57 PDT 1996
Article: 475871 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.nstn.ca!newsflash.concordia.ca!newsfeed.pitt.edu!news.duq.edu!newsgate.duke.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.abortion,dc.politics,alt.president.clinton,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa
Subject: Re: how do Hillary/Feminists justify the slaughter preborn sisters ???
Date: 5 Oct 1996 01:29:18 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 18
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References:   <32541D12.6895@xtra.co.nz> 
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In  Dave
Brickner  writes: 
>
>
>It would be an interesting response if the pro-choice (murder) crowd
would be 
>willing to rationalize their goals in the light of morality.??
>

 Pro-life (pro-lie) morality: "If a woman doesn't want to be a mother,
then she shouldn't enjoy sex. (She shouldn't enjoy it too much anyway.
It isn't nice.)"
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 11:10:58 PDT 1996
Article: 475947 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!netnews.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.abortion,dc.politics,alt.president.clinton,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa
Subject: Re: how do Hillary/Feminists justify the slaughter preborn sisters ???
Date: 5 Oct 1996 03:33:54 GMT
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References:   <32541D12.6895@xtra.co.nz>  <534dle$1lt@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com> <534g7g$3b1@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com>
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X-NETCOM-Date: Fri Oct 04 10:33:54 PM CDT 1996
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In <534g7g$3b1@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com> jdgjdg1@ix.netcom.com(Jim Green)
writes: 
>
>In <534dle$1lt@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com> sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven
>Malcolm Anderson) writes: 
>>
>>In  Dave
>>Brickner  writes: 
>>>
>>>
>>>It would be an interesting response if the pro-choice (murder) crowd
>>would be 
>>>willing to rationalize their goals in the light of morality.
>
>That's easy.... WITH SPIN! 
>
>People who want to allow the killing of children are not called
>anti-fetus or anti-child but PRO-Choice. They are rarely even termed
>pro-abortion. 
>
>Even abortion is a misnomer. To abort typically means to stop doing
>something you are actively doing. In this case "abortion" is
>proactively stopping and interfering with a naturally occuring and
>independantly occuring process that would ordinarily proceed with the
>involvement but no consious effort on the part of the mother.
>
>People who are interested in the safety of the unborn child are
labeled
>as Fascist, and controlling because they want to prevent selfserving
>behaviour, dangerous to the unborn for a period of nine months, while
>the people who kill for convienince, wiping out entire lives, are
>labeled as victims. 
>
>While I do not believe in legislating morality. I believe that those
>who abort deserve no more of my respect than any other child abuser or
>murderer. They are all David Rothenburgs in my book.  
>
>The most strange and unexplainable legal part of this, is the idea
that
>a mother can plan and pay for the assistance of another for the death
>of their children; but if she's pregnant and gets hit by a drunk
driver
>causing a loss of the unborn child, the other driver can be charged
>with vehicular homicide. So the outlook of the legal system is that if
>the child is wanted, he has full human rights and is an irreplaceable
>human being, but purely on the whim of the mother, suddenly becomes
>simply an abnormal growth that falls victim to a sterile and uncaring 
>medical procedure.

 Spoken like a true woman-hater.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 11:33:56 PDT 1996
Article: 127525 of soc.culture.african.american
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,soc.culture.usa,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.elections,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.president.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why DO people vote Democrat?
Date: 4 Oct 1996 22:16:55 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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>>: "In all of these nearly 18 years that I have had the pleasure of 
>>: my association with Bob Dole, I have never known Bob to give even
>>: a hint of breaking his word, because if ever there was a man in 
>>: the U.S. Senate for whom we knew his word is his bond, that is 
>>: Bob Dole." 
>>:      -- Nebraska Sen. James Exon (Congressional Record, 6/11/96)   

 James Exon is the jerk who wants to censor the net.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct  5 11:38:02 PDT 1996
Article: 54271 of alt.discrimination
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.african.american,soc.culture.usa,alt.discrimination,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.elections,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.president.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh
Subject: Re: Why DO people vote Democrat?
Date: 4 Oct 1996 22:16:55 GMT
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>>: "In all of these nearly 18 years that I have had the pleasure of 
>>: my association with Bob Dole, I have never known Bob to give even
>>: a hint of breaking his word, because if ever there was a man in 
>>: the U.S. Senate for whom we knew his word is his bond, that is 
>>: Bob Dole." 
>>:      -- Nebraska Sen. James Exon (Congressional Record, 6/11/96)   

 James Exon is the jerk who wants to censor the net.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sun Oct  6 09:50:23 PDT 1996
Article: 476442 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!nnrp.info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!howland.erols.net!netnews.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.cabal,alt.philosophy.objectivism,talk.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.misc,talk.environment,alt.fan.noam-chomsky,alt.economics.austrian-school,ca.politics,tx.politics,ny.politics,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.usa.constitution,talk.politics.misc,talk.philosophy.misc,alt.christnet.philosophy,talk.religion.misc,alt.christnet
Subject: Re: Ayn Rand, "objectivism" & Libertarians?...the Cult
Date: 5 Oct 1996 23:47:48 GMT
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In <5363ue$9md@alpine.psnw.com> bashford@psnw.com (Crash) writes: 
>
>
>  Yep,  sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote on 3 Oct
>1996 18:56:29 GMT about:
>   Re: Ayn Rand, "objectivism" & Libertarians?...the Cult 
>
>> bja@ix.netcom.com(Jim Austin) writes: 
>>> bashford@psnw.com (Crash) writes:
>
>>>>>>  So?  What is this relationship?    This
>>>>>>is my take on it:  Author Ayn Rand who believed that selfishness
and
>>>>>>egoism were good and moral,

 And I agree with her on that point.

 and attempted to do her social engineering
>>>>>>in that direction, and created the cult she ironically called
>>>>>>"objectivism", and that the political arm of this so-called
philosophy
>>>>>>or quasi-religion is called "Libertarianism".  But not
technically.
>>>>>>Not all Libertarians are Randists and vice versa, but I think
that

 I don't consider myself an Objectivist. (E.g., I'm a polytheist, not
an atheist, but I don't want to get into that here.) I'm speaking for
myself here, not Ayn Rand or anybody else.

> ....
>>>>>>From an essay on the Net: Reason, Egoism, Freedom:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>-  Ayn Rand summarized her philosophy in three words:
>>>>>>-  reason, egoism, freedom. She summarized the antithesis of her
>>>>>>-  philosophy in three words as well: mysticism, altruism, force.
>>>>>>[...]  Mysticism
>>>>>>-  Rand defined mysticism as ``the acceptance of allegations
without
>>>>>>-  evidence or proof, either apart from or against the evidence
of
>>>>>>-  one's senses and one's reason.'' Mysticism is the belief that
>>>>>>-  there is short-cut to knowledge; the mystic doesn't bother
with
>
>>>>>>So while scientists can rely on the authority of other sciences,
it
>>>>>>seems that so-called "objectivists" have a pretty small world
>>>>>>limited to what they can directly experience or examine.  For
example,
>>>>>>if a biologist needs some info from geology, he just gets it, he
need
>>>>>>not re-invent the wheel. It seems the so-called "objectivists"
can not
>>>>>>rely on scientific authority.
>....
>>>>>>They must live in a world smaller than dittohead's.  One
>>>>>>wonders if this contributes to the growing popularity of:
>>>>>> "everything is only a matter of (political) opinion?"
>>>>>>The ozone hole is a hoax?  Tax is theft?  Selfishness is moral?
>
>> "Selfishness is immoral" means that it is immoral to breathe, eat,
>>enjoy sex, listen to music, or look at a sunset unless you can prove
>>that you're doing it "for the good of humanity".
>
>Rand says selfishness is good.  In fact, she derives morality
>from selfishness, and calls altruism immoral.  The dictionary
>says "selfish"; is caring *only* for oneself.  So your examples fail. 
>There is nothing wrong with caring for oneself,

 I'm glad you finally acknowledge that.

 but *only*
>for oneself?    

 Not. The word is used, esp. by those who constantly attack
"selfishness", to mean any egoistic act or any altruistic act that has
an egoistic motive. Communists demand that you give up all your
property and time to the state or the commune and denounce you as
selfish if you refuse. Nazis demand that everything be sacrificed to
"the purity of the race". The "moral majority" constantly denounce
women as selfish who demand the same choices in career, sexuality,
etc., that men have and who refuse to conform to "traditional family
roles". Anti-porn pseudo-"feminists" demand that men (and women too)
give up their selfish sexual desires. Guilt-manipulators whine: "You're
so selfish. You won't give up your happiness to serve _me_." or "Who
are you to hold on to your own beliefs. How can you be right and
everyone else wrong? You're so selfish." You yourself have,
unfortunately, written post after post saying that the individual
exists for the sake of the species, which I flat deny.
 Ayn Rand once gave an excellent illustration of exactly what I mean by
selfishness: If you had to choose between saving your wife's life and
saving the lives of ten other women, the selfish man would save his
wife. I'm proud to be selfish.   

>>-- 
>>sma4@ix.netcom.com
>>"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
>> wanting to be by oneself,
>> being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich
Nietzsche
>
>Some have said that Nietzsche is real philosophy, and Randism
>is akin to dittoheadism.

 I'm not a dittohead. I think for myself. (I do prefer Nietzsche to
Rand, as he was a more complex thinker in many ways.)

  Philosophy for those not able to discern
>her rhetorical tricks.  I've said that Randism is Limbaughtomyville
>served in a book.  Populist cults that derive their popularity  via
>very good "approach and presentation", the pitch.
>
>Some say this is good, she brings philosophy to Joe Sixpack, and
>when they grow philosophically, they will see her for what she is.
>My concern is for those who approach her dogmatically, as a cult.

 I don't.

>Almost by definition, they will not seek out other philosophies,
>and will not achieve this growth.  They will be stuck in the mean,
>egoistic world of a spoiled child..
>
>Many religions bad-mouth other religions.  Rand has made some
>pretty wild and unsupported disparaging remarks about most other
>philosophers.  Both cases I see as the preservation mechanisms of
>dogma.
>
>>>>>>-  Ayn Rand summarized her philosophy in three words:
>>>>>>-  reason, egoism, freedom.
>
>Yet that is not what we see when we look at her followers.  We see
>dogma, egoism, and all the freedom you can rent or buy. 
>
>>>>>>- She summarized the antithesis of her
>>>>>>-  philosophy in three words as well: mysticism, altruism, force.
>
>--Doug
>
>Re: In a Libertarian world, Earth is scraped bare for the dollar
>  "In a Libertarian world, the right to pollute can be
>      purchased by the Rich Boys.  And why not?" 
>      ---  Lazarus.Long, 31 Aug 96 16:20:50  ---
>
>   
>
>

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sun Oct  6 09:50:25 PDT 1996
Article: 476498 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.abortion,dc.politics,alt.president.clinton,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa
Subject: Re: how do Hillary/Feminists justify the slaughter preborn sisters ???
Date: 6 Oct 1996 01:20:37 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 32
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In <534oap$o2f@dfw-ixnews4.ix.netcom.com> jdgjdg1@ix.netcom.com(Jim
Green) writes: 
>
>In <534kv2$hkk@dfw-ixnews8.ix.netcom.com> sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven
>Malcolm Anderson) writes: 

>> Spoken like a true woman-hater.
>
>When logic fails, I guess a label will have to do!
>You fail to take into consideration that half the babies saved, if pro
>life/pro child forces have their way, will be women.

 Born to spend their lives as breeding machines.

>A perfect example of the "spin" I was talking about. While I want to
>save these baby women and you want to kill then at will (maybe just
>because you'd rather have a boy)

 No.

, somehow I end up the women hater.
>
>If I hated them, I'd want to kill them at birth...just like you!  

 You like them -- "in their place".

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sun Oct  6 15:26:54 PDT 1996
Article: 96272 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Turncoat "libertarians" are better off voting for Bill than for Bob (if they can't do the right thing)
Date: 6 Oct 1996 20:52:15 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In  mkennedy@iglou.com (Max Kennedy) writes: 
>
>sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote:
>
>> Stalin fought Hitler in World War II.
>
>Only after Hitler backstabbed him.  Before that, they were allies.
>
>Max Kennedy

 Quite true. A "politically incorrect" fact not too much mentioned
today: Hitler is blamed for starting that war by invading Poland.
Actually, both Hitler and Stalin started it by agreeing to split up
Poland between them. So why isn't Stalin also blamed?

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sun Oct  6 16:33:12 PDT 1996
Article: 96283 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism
Subject: Re: Turncoat "libertarians" are better off voting for Bill than for Bob (if they can't do the right thing)
Date: 6 Oct 1996 21:59:15 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In  msch19@mail.idt.net
(Mike Schneider) writes: 
>
>In article <534m61$imu@dfw-ixnews8.ix.netcom.com>,
>sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote:
>
>> >> > Whatever you say about
>> >> >Dornan, he's not an "establishment" republican like Dole,
>> >> 
>> >>  Dornan is a totalitarian scumbag who wants Big Brother in our
>> >> bedrooms. He's no more "libertarian" than Josef Stalin.
>> >
>> >   Perhaps, but he's LESS of a totalitarian scumbag than either
>> Clinton or Dole,
>> 
>>  No, he's not.
>
>
>   Other "totalitarian" policies being the same, Dornan votes against
tax
>hikes and Clinton and Dole vote for them, so, he's less of one.

 Oh, goody!! There's a cop in my bedroom, but my taxes are lower this
year. I'm FREE!! WHOOPEEEE!!!
 No thank you.


-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  8 10:52:22 PDT 1996
Article: 477690 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!nnrp.info.ucla.edu!agate!howland.erols.net!EU.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,dc.politics,alt.president.clinton,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa,soc.men,alt.feminism,alt.mens-rights
Subject: Re: Our P.C. Military....
Date: 7 Oct 1996 21:58:03 GMT
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 The very title of this thread is a lie. If by "P.C." you mean
feminist, then why not just come out and say feminist? Ah, but "Our
Feminist Military" wouldn't carry all the same connotations as "Our
P.C. Military", would it?
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  8 10:52:23 PDT 1996
Article: 477693 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.nstn.ca!newsflash.concordia.ca!newsfeed.pitt.edu!scramble.lm.com!hookup!nntp-hub2.barrnet.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!news.enteract.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.abortion,dc.politics,alt.president.clinton,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.reform,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.equality,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.clinton,alt.impeach.clinton,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.fan.newt-gingrich,alt.fan.g-gordon-liddy,alt.current-events.usa
Subject: Re: how do Hillary/Feminists justify the slaughter preborn sisters ???
Date: 7 Oct 1996 21:46:07 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 29
Message-ID: <53btmv$fa0@sjx-ixn2.ix.netcom.com>
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In <538ov9$si9@dfw-ixnews12.ix.netcom.com>
rolling@ix.netcom.com(william m hebler ) writes: 
>
>In  Morgoth
> writes: 
>>
>>I do know. Birth control is cheap and easy to get.
>>
>>There is condoms for the guys.
>>Norplant (its a spiderly looking thing in a womens arm that
>>dispenses hormones to keep a women from being able to become
>>pregnant, I think it not the only one, it take surgery but it is
>>cheap last I heard).
>>The Pill
>>IUDs (Intra Uninary devices?).
>>The sponge
>>and a few other I forget.
>
>
>you forgot not having sex...or is that not an option anymore?

 You suffer from clitoris envy. Get a dick.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  8 10:52:24 PDT 1996
Article: 477713 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.president.clinton,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 7 Oct 1996 22:01:40 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <53buk4$o6p@dfw-ixnews3.ix.netcom.com>
References:  <538vqi$bj3@paperboy.ids.net> <539ape$b8g@newshost.cyberramp.net> <53bm3o$qve@paperboy.ids.net>
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In <53bm3o$qve@paperboy.ids.net> zarlenga@conan.ids.net (Michael
Zarlenga) writes: 
>
>Mitchell Holman (holman@cyberramp.net) wrote:
>:  Instead of "rephrasing" the ACLU position, why not post it here
>:  for all to see in it's *original* form?
>
>It can be found (with some digging) at http://www.aclu.org  (the
>server is not responding right now)
>
>Their position flies in the face of the words of the amendment and
>the related writings of the authors of the Constitution about the
>amendment.
>
>The ACLU's position is that the 2nd Amendment is primarily a COL-
>LECTIVE, not individual right.  That "the people" in the 2nd Amend-
>ment are not the same "people" in the rest of the Bill of Rights.
>
>
>:      Believe it or not, not all of us need the "help" of your
re-phrasing...
>
>Well, Ripley, go see for yourself.  I gave you the URL.
>
>--
>-- Mike Zarlenga
>   finger zarlenga@conan.ids.net  for PGP public key
>   Harry Browne (Libertarian) for President in 1996

 That the 2nd Amendment protects only a government "right" and not an
_individual_ right to keep and bear arms is all of a piece with the
argument that the 1st amendment protects only "political" speech and
not "pornographic" speech. Both are total lies.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  8 11:09:41 PDT 1996
Article: 323138 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.president.clinton,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 7 Oct 1996 22:01:40 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <53buk4$o6p@dfw-ixnews3.ix.netcom.com>
References:  <538vqi$bj3@paperboy.ids.net> <539ape$b8g@newshost.cyberramp.net> <53bm3o$qve@paperboy.ids.net>
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In <53bm3o$qve@paperboy.ids.net> zarlenga@conan.ids.net (Michael
Zarlenga) writes: 
>
>Mitchell Holman (holman@cyberramp.net) wrote:
>:  Instead of "rephrasing" the ACLU position, why not post it here
>:  for all to see in it's *original* form?
>
>It can be found (with some digging) at http://www.aclu.org  (the
>server is not responding right now)
>
>Their position flies in the face of the words of the amendment and
>the related writings of the authors of the Constitution about the
>amendment.
>
>The ACLU's position is that the 2nd Amendment is primarily a COL-
>LECTIVE, not individual right.  That "the people" in the 2nd Amend-
>ment are not the same "people" in the rest of the Bill of Rights.
>
>
>:      Believe it or not, not all of us need the "help" of your
re-phrasing...
>
>Well, Ripley, go see for yourself.  I gave you the URL.
>
>--
>-- Mike Zarlenga
>   finger zarlenga@conan.ids.net  for PGP public key
>   Harry Browne (Libertarian) for President in 1996

 That the 2nd Amendment protects only a government "right" and not an
_individual_ right to keep and bear arms is all of a piece with the
argument that the 1st amendment protects only "political" speech and
not "pornographic" speech. Both are total lies.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  8 17:27:57 PDT 1996
Article: 478436 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!hookup!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!arclight.uoregon.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.president.clinton,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 8 Oct 1996 21:36:06 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <53ehg6$712@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>
References:  
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In  Randolph Langley
 writes: 
>
>sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) writes:

>>  That the 2nd Amendment protects only a government "right" and not
an
>> _individual_ right to keep and bear arms is all of a piece with the
>> argument that the 1st amendment protects only "political" speech and
>> not "pornographic" speech. Both are total lies.
>> 
>
>If the people in the Second amendment refers to the state, then the
>people of the First does also: therefore, only the state has the right
>to free speech, free assembly, or free exercise of religion. I guess
>that only the state has the right to be secure in its home, or be held
>to answer for a capital crime, or the right to a speedy trial.
>
>Yeah, right.
>
>This idea of " people == state " in the Second amendment, and 
>" people == individuals " in all of the others is completely
nitwitted.
>
>rdl

 Precisely.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  8 19:15:58 PDT 1996
Article: 323581 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!hookup!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!arclight.uoregon.edu!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.president.clinton,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 8 Oct 1996 21:36:06 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <53ehg6$712@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>
References:  
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In  Randolph Langley
 writes: 
>
>sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) writes:

>>  That the 2nd Amendment protects only a government "right" and not
an
>> _individual_ right to keep and bear arms is all of a piece with the
>> argument that the 1st amendment protects only "political" speech and
>> not "pornographic" speech. Both are total lies.
>> 
>
>If the people in the Second amendment refers to the state, then the
>people of the First does also: therefore, only the state has the right
>to free speech, free assembly, or free exercise of religion. I guess
>that only the state has the right to be secure in its home, or be held
>to answer for a capital crime, or the right to a speedy trial.
>
>Yeah, right.
>
>This idea of " people == state " in the Second amendment, and 
>" people == individuals " in all of the others is completely
nitwitted.
>
>rdl

 Precisely.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  8 21:38:10 PDT 1996
Article: 478593 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.mindlink.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!news.sgi.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.president.clinton,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 8 Oct 1996 21:49:22 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 22
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References:  <538vqi$bj3@paperboy.ids.net> <539ape$b8g@newshost.cyberramp.net> <53b9bn$194@hpcvsnz.cv.hp.com>   <53dutm$55c@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>
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In <53dutm$55c@nnrp1.news.primenet.com> frdmftr@primenet.com (Freedom
Fighter) writes: 

 

>Don Cline, WB6OCO 
>PGP Public Key available by request.
>===============================================================
>God made Man (and Woman).  Sam Colt made Man (and Woman) Equal.
>===============================================================
>If government can do it to THEM, government can do it to YOU.
>===============================================================

 As a feminist, I totally agree with _that_. To hell with gun control
and Big Brother government!

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct  8 21:38:11 PDT 1996
Article: 478597 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.mindlink.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!news.sgi.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.radio,talk.politics.theory,talk.politics.republican,talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,ca.politics,az.politics,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.correct,alt.philosophy.objectivism,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.society.conservatism,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,
Subject: Re: 50 States or 50 Dictatorships? (why did we fight the Civil War?)
Date: 8 Oct 1996 21:58:48 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 14
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References:   <322AF97C.FE4@nash.tds.net> <50nknj$3fr@nntp1.best.com> <32554534.41B4@suite.com>  
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In  Tony
Grundon  writes: 

 

 "State's rights" is a _fraud_ when it comes to abortion, pornography,
guns, etc.. It means that state legislatures own us. We are their
property. It does _not_ reduce government in any way.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  9 10:09:54 PDT 1996
Article: 478661 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!tor.istar!east.istar!news.nstn.ca!newsflash.concordia.ca!newsfeed.pitt.edu!gatech!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!newsfeed.internetmci.com!feed1.news.erols.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.president.clinton,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 8 Oct 1996 21:51:34 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <53eid6$925@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com>
References:  <538vqi$bj3@paperboy.ids.net> <539ape$b8g@newshost.cyberramp.net> <53b9bn$194@hpcvsnz.cv.hp.com>   <53dutm$55c@nnrp1.news.primenet.com> <325A81CD.17D@tandem.com>
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In <325A81CD.17D@tandem.com> Lawrence Kennon 
writes: 
>
>Freedom Fighter wrote:
>> 
>
>> > There is nothing in the second amendment that
>> >guarantees your right to own an Uzi. Sorry...
>> 
>> There is nothing in the Second Amendment or anywhere in the U.S.
>> Constitution delegating any authority to the federal government to
>> tell me I can't either.
>
>And the above is a very important point. In a constitutional
>republic -- the form of government we are supposed to have in 
>the United States of America -- the government must justify 
>_every_ claim to a power to proscribe or regulate anything 
>by showing where it is granted that power in the constitution.
>Period. That is how it is supposed to work. That is what the
>term "limited government" means. If we fail to hold government
>to that standard then what we have is _unlimited_ government
>and to hell with any concept of having a constitution.
>
>lk

 Precisely.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  9 10:09:56 PDT 1996
Article: 478746 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!vertex.tor.hookup.net!loki.tor.hookup.net!hookup!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!unixg.ubc.ca!van-bc!n1van.istar!van.istar!west.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!n3ott.istar!imci2!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsgate.compuserve.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.cabal,alt.philosophy.objectivism,talk.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.misc,talk.environment,alt.fan.noam-chomsky,alt.economics.austrian-school,ca.politics,tx.politics,ny.politics,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.usa.constitution,talk.politics.misc,talk.philosophy.misc,alt.christnet.philosophy,talk.religion.misc,alt.christnet
Subject: Re: Ayn Rand, "objectivism" & Libertarians?...the Cult
Date: 3 Oct 1996 18:56:29 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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Message-ID: <53128t$ie0@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>
References: <4rei66$omb@geraldo.cc.utexas.edu>  <4rjl3i$9um@mule1.mindspring.com>  <4rk9ij$d9i@mule2.mindspring.com> <4rl35v$7t9@nntp1.best.com> <4rlu6j$1r8m@mule1.mindspring.com>  <02e_9607082356@rational.vaxxine.com> <4tobnb$8pe@alpine.psnw.com> <4tpdjh$3mq@news.one.net> <4trm0k$5pf@alpine.psnw.com> <5259u9$bdf@alpine.psnw.com> <527bl8$pgr@sjx-ixn2.ix.netcom.com> <52pv0p$dmm@alpine.psnw.com> <52rcai$14p@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com>
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In <52rcai$14p@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com> bja@ix.netcom.com(Jim Austin)
writes: 
>
>In <52pv0p$dmm@alpine.psnw.com> bashford@psnw.com (Crash) writes: 

>>>>They must live in a world smaller than dittohead's.  One
>>>>wonders if this contributes to the growing popularity of:
>>>> "everything is only a matter of (political) opinion?"
>>>>The ozone hole is a hoax?  Tax is theft?  Selfishness is moral?

 "Selfishness is immoral" means that it is immoral to breathe, eat,
enjoy sex, listen to music, or look at a sunset unless you can prove
that you're doing it "for the good of humanity".
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  9 10:46:36 PDT 1996
Article: 323665 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.mindlink.net!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!news.msfc.nasa.gov!news.sgi.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.president.clinton,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 8 Oct 1996 21:49:22 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 22
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In <53dutm$55c@nnrp1.news.primenet.com> frdmftr@primenet.com (Freedom
Fighter) writes: 

 

>Don Cline, WB6OCO 
>PGP Public Key available by request.
>===============================================================
>God made Man (and Woman).  Sam Colt made Man (and Woman) Equal.
>===============================================================
>If government can do it to THEM, government can do it to YOU.
>===============================================================

 As a feminist, I totally agree with _that_. To hell with gun control
and Big Brother government!

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct  9 10:46:38 PDT 1996
Article: 323693 of talk.politics.guns
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.president.clinton,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 8 Oct 1996 21:51:34 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 32
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In <325A81CD.17D@tandem.com> Lawrence Kennon 
writes: 
>
>Freedom Fighter wrote:
>> 
>
>> > There is nothing in the second amendment that
>> >guarantees your right to own an Uzi. Sorry...
>> 
>> There is nothing in the Second Amendment or anywhere in the U.S.
>> Constitution delegating any authority to the federal government to
>> tell me I can't either.
>
>And the above is a very important point. In a constitutional
>republic -- the form of government we are supposed to have in 
>the United States of America -- the government must justify 
>_every_ claim to a power to proscribe or regulate anything 
>by showing where it is granted that power in the constitution.
>Period. That is how it is supposed to work. That is what the
>term "limited government" means. If we fail to hold government
>to that standard then what we have is _unlimited_ government
>and to hell with any concept of having a constitution.
>
>lk

 Precisely.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 10 17:58:29 PDT 1996
Article: 480340 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsgate.compuserve.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 10 Oct 1996 21:06:55 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In <53het2$g9o@gondor.sdsu.edu> sheckler@rohan.sdsu.edu (don) writes: 

 

 Milt Shook's arguments confirmed a suspicion I have had for a long
time: Behind the gun-controllers' lie (that the 2nd Amendment protects
only a "collective right" rather than an individual right to keep and
bear arms) lies a more general hostility to the very concept of
individual rights. Thanks for making that explicit, Milt.  
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 10 17:58:30 PDT 1996
Article: 480347 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.radio,talk.politics.theory,talk.politics.republican,talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,ca.politics,az.politics,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.correct,alt.philosophy.objectivism,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.society.conservatism,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,
Subject: Re: 50 States or 50 Dictatorships? (why did we fight the Civil War?)
Date: 10 Oct 1996 21:15:16 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In  best@anasazi.com (Mike Best) writes: 
>
>In article <53eiqo$fcs@dfw-ixnews2.ix.netcom.com>
sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) writes:
>>In  Tony
>>Grundon  writes: 
>>
>> 
>>
>> "State's rights" is a _fraud_ when it comes to abortion,
pornography,
>>guns, etc.. It means that state legislatures own us. We are their
>>property. It does _not_ reduce government in any way.

 

 READ the Constitution. Esp., read the 9th _and_ 10th Amendments. Also
read the 14th Amendment. Governments do _not_ have rights. Only
_individuals_ have rights. Governments have only _delegated_ and
stringently _limited_ powers.
 As for your suggestion: no, I'm not going to move from state to state
until all 50 turn socialist. I'm going to stay where I am and defend my
freedom here.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 10 17:58:31 PDT 1996
Article: 480354 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!van-bc!unixg.ubc.ca!info.ucla.edu!csulb.edu!news.sgi.com!howland.erols.net!EU.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.radio,talk.politics.theory,talk.politics.republican,talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,ca.politics,az.politics,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.correct,alt.philosophy.objectivism,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.society.conservatism,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,
Subject: Re: 50 States or 50 Dictatorships? (why did we fight the Civil War?)
Date: 10 Oct 1996 21:25:30 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In  best@anasazi.com (Mike Best) writes: 
>
>In article <53eiqo$fcs@dfw-ixnews2.ix.netcom.com>
sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) writes:
>>In  Tony
>>Grundon  writes: 
>>
>> 
>>
>> "State's rights" is a _fraud_ when it comes to abortion,
pornography,
>>guns, etc.. It means that state legislatures own us. We are their
>>property. It does _not_ reduce government in any way.
>
>Yet another fine example of why our education system is a failure.
>
>I suppose it isn't worth the effort to explain to someone, with the
>depth that you display, the federal principle in the Constitution
>much less the original meaning behind the 10th amendment.  

 It certainly isn't anything like this: "D-uh. Federal government =
Big, Bad, Evil. State government = God over our lives."

>Suffice it to say that there is nowhere in the Constitution a
statement
>that Medicare nor Welfare are federal responsibilities.  Any
entitlement
>is an invention of the federal government and while it is not
unconstitu-
>tional to run a federal welfare program neither is it unconstitutional
to
>run welfare at the state level.

 Welfare is not a right. Property is a right (see the 14th Amendment).

>Further, at least when something is done at the state level that you 
>disagree with you have the option to move to another state.  You have
>no such ability when the resolution is at the federal level, where can
>you run?

 Keep running from state to state 'till every state turns socialist. No
thank you.

>Mike Best
>best@anasazi.com

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 10 17:58:32 PDT 1996
Article: 480396 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 10 Oct 1996 22:04:05 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <53jrsl$sjj@sjx-ixn5.ix.netcom.com>
References:   <53e7j2$28m@ovation.rsn.hp.com>  <53f82s$kgs@rac10.wam.umd.edu>  <53het2$g9o@gondor.sdsu.edu>  <53io2l$1ar@netaxs.com>
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In <53io2l$1ar@netaxs.com> careyb@netaxs.com (Brian Carey) writes: 
>
>Milt (mshook@U.Arizona.EDU) wrote:
>
>: We can yell, "Clinton is a f***face outside until we're blue in the
face,
>: so long as we don't do it in a threatening manner. Collective right
means
>: that I can do it and YOU can do it and HE can do it and SHE can do
it.
>
>Using that logic:  I can own a handgun and YOU can own a handgun and
SHE
>can own a handgun....

 Precisely.

>
>-- 
>Brian M. Carey --> careyb@netaxs.com
>
>"Christianity is part of the common law of England."
>                         --- Blackstone, "Commentaries on the Laws of
>                             England," Book IV Ch. 4, comment
>
>"The laws and institutions of all the States are built on the
foundation 
>of reverence for Christianity."  ---Supreme Court Justice Wm. Strong,
>                                    "Two Lectures upon the Relations
of
>                                    Civil Law to Church Property," p.
32.
>
>"Christianity is and always has been a part of the Common Law of this 
>State.  Christianity without the spiritual artillery of European
countries 
>- not Christianity founded on any particular religious tenets - not 
>Christianity with an established church and titles and spiritual
courts, 
>but Christianity with liberty and conscience to all men."
>                                 --- Supreme Court of PA

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 10 19:45:24 PDT 1996
Article: 324576 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!spool.mu.edu!newspump.sol.net!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!newsgate.compuserve.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 10 Oct 1996 21:06:55 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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References:   <53e7j2$28m@ovation.rsn.hp.com>  <53f82s$kgs@rac10.wam.umd.edu>  <53het2$g9o@gondor.sdsu.edu>
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In <53het2$g9o@gondor.sdsu.edu> sheckler@rohan.sdsu.edu (don) writes: 

 

 Milt Shook's arguments confirmed a suspicion I have had for a long
time: Behind the gun-controllers' lie (that the 2nd Amendment protects
only a "collective right" rather than an individual right to keep and
bear arms) lies a more general hostility to the very concept of
individual rights. Thanks for making that explicit, Milt.  
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 10 19:45:26 PDT 1996
Article: 324594 of talk.politics.guns
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.clinton,alt.politics.correct,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.society.conservatism,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: ACLU & the 2nd Amendment
Date: 10 Oct 1996 22:04:05 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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References:   <53e7j2$28m@ovation.rsn.hp.com>  <53f82s$kgs@rac10.wam.umd.edu>  <53het2$g9o@gondor.sdsu.edu>  <53io2l$1ar@netaxs.com>
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In <53io2l$1ar@netaxs.com> careyb@netaxs.com (Brian Carey) writes: 
>
>Milt (mshook@U.Arizona.EDU) wrote:
>
>: We can yell, "Clinton is a f***face outside until we're blue in the
face,
>: so long as we don't do it in a threatening manner. Collective right
means
>: that I can do it and YOU can do it and HE can do it and SHE can do
it.
>
>Using that logic:  I can own a handgun and YOU can own a handgun and
SHE
>can own a handgun....

 Precisely.

>
>-- 
>Brian M. Carey --> careyb@netaxs.com
>
>"Christianity is part of the common law of England."
>                         --- Blackstone, "Commentaries on the Laws of
>                             England," Book IV Ch. 4, comment
>
>"The laws and institutions of all the States are built on the
foundation 
>of reverence for Christianity."  ---Supreme Court Justice Wm. Strong,
>                                    "Two Lectures upon the Relations
of
>                                    Civil Law to Church Property," p.
32.
>
>"Christianity is and always has been a part of the Common Law of this 
>State.  Christianity without the spiritual artillery of European
countries 
>- not Christianity founded on any particular religious tenets - not 
>Christianity with an established church and titles and spiritual
courts, 
>but Christianity with liberty and conscience to all men."
>                                 --- Supreme Court of PA

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Fri Oct 11 09:44:19 PDT 1996
Article: 97826 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.libertarian,alt.philosophy.objectivism,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.clinton,alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater,alt.conspiracy
Subject: Re: Why this Libertarian will vote Republican in November
Date: 11 Oct 1996 04:36:43 GMT
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In <53jek4$1qt@ren.cei.net> timow1@cei.net (Timothy F. Watson, Sr.)
writes: 
>
>sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote:
>
>>In  weedeatr@netcom.com (Weed Eater
>>(munch munch)) writes: 
>
>
>>>All that said I will vote Libertarian for senate, but that is
because
>>I 
>>>am represented by Jesse Helms and thus have no choice :).
>
>> Good. Because Jesse Helms is a despicable totalitarian scumbag.
>>-- 
>>
>
>What this poster means is that Jesse Helms has some strongly held
>views which he acts upon and with which this poster very strongly
>disagrees.  Helms is no more a "totaliarian" than is Teddy Kennedy or
>anyone on else on the far left who holds and acts upon strongly held
>views.  But it a mark of intolerance to label those with whom you
>disagree with such epithets.

 Quite true. I _am_ intolerant of scumbags like Helms who would
extinguish my freedoms.

>But let's get back to Slick Willie and his sleaze and corruption.
>
>
>
>Tim Watson
>

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Fri Oct 11 10:48:31 PDT 1996
Article: 480626 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.democrats.d,alt.cabal,alt.philosophy.objectivism,talk.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.misc,talk.environment,alt.fan.noam-chomsky,alt.economics.austrian-school,ca.politics,tx.politics,ny.politics,alt.politics.radical-left,alt.politics.usa.constitution,talk.politics.misc,talk.philosophy.misc,alt.christnet.philosophy,talk.religion.misc,alt.christnet
Subject: Re: Ayn Rand, "objectivism" & Libertarians?...the Cult
Date: 11 Oct 1996 03:39:03 GMT
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In <53i3u9$oml@alpine.psnw.com> bashford@psnw.com (Crash) writes: 
>
>
>  Yep,  sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote on 5 Oct
>1996 23:47:48 GMT about:
>   Re: Ayn Rand, "objectivism" & Libertarians?...the Cult 
>
>>bashford@psnw.com (Crash) writes: 
>>>  Yep,  sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson) wrote:
>>>> bja@ix.netcom.com(Jim Austin) writes: 
>>>>> bashford@psnw.com (Crash) writes:
>>>
>>>>>>>>  So?  What is this relationship?    This
>>>>>>>>is my take on it:  Author Ayn Rand who believed
>>>>>>>>that selfishness and egoism were good and moral,
>
>> And I agree with her on that point.
>
>>>>>>>> and attempted to do her social engineering in that
>>>>>>>>direction, and created the cult she ironically called
>>>>>>>>"objectivism", and that the political arm of this 
>>>>>>>>so-called philosophy or quasi-religion 
>>>>>>>>is called "Libertarianism".  But not technically.
>>>>>>>> Not all Libertarians are Randists and vice versa,
>>>>>>>> but I think that
>
>> I don't consider myself an Objectivist. (E.g., I'm a polytheist, not
>>an atheist, but I don't want to get into that here.) I'm speaking for
>>myself here, not Ayn Rand or anybody else.
>
>Perhaps Objectivism is not your religion, but you do sound
>generally like a Randist.
>
>>> ....
>>>>>>>>From an essay on the Net: Reason, Egoism, Freedom:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>-  Ayn Rand summarized her philosophy in three words:
>>>>>>>>-  reason, egoism, freedom. She summarized the antithesis of
her
>>>>>>>>-  philosophy in three words as well: mysticism, altruism,
force.
>>>>>>>>[...]  Mysticism
>>>>>>>>-  Rand defined mysticism as ``the acceptance of
>>>>>>>>-  allegations without evidence or proof,
>>>>>>>>-  either apart from or against the evidence of
>>>>>>>>-  one's senses and one's reason.'' Mysticism is the
>>>>>>>>-  belief that there is short-cut to knowledge; the
>>>>>>>>-  mystic doesn't bother with
>>>
>Crash wrote:
>>>>>>>>So while scientists can rely on the authority of 
>>>>>>>>other sciences, it seems that so-called 
>>>>>>>>"objectivists" have a pretty small world limited to 
>>>>>>>>what they can directly experience or examine.  For
>>>>>>>>example, if a biologist needs some info from 
>>>>>>>>geology, he just gets it, he need not re-invent the 
>>>>>>>>wheel. It seems the so-called "objectivists" can not
>>>>>>>>rely on scientific authority.
>>>....
>>>>>>>>They must live in a world smaller than dittohead's.  One
>>>>>>>>wonders if this contributes to the growing popularity of:
>>>>>>>> "everything is only a matter of (political) opinion?"
>>>>>>>>The ozone hole is a hoax?  Tax is theft?  Selfishness is moral?
>>>
>>>> "Selfishness is immoral" means that it is immoral to breathe, eat,
>>>>enjoy sex, listen to music, or look at a sunset unless you can
prove
>>>>that you're doing it "for the good of humanity".
>>>
>Crash wrote:
>>>Rand says selfishness is good.  In fact, she derives morality
>>>from selfishness, and calls altruism immoral.  The dictionary
>>>says "selfish"; is caring *only* for oneself.  So your examples
>>> fail.  There is nothing wrong with caring for oneself,
>
>> I'm glad you finally acknowledge that.
>
>Finally?  You seem to be tilting at strawmen. 
>
>>> but *only* for oneself?    
>
>> Not. The word is used, esp. by those who constantly attack
>>"selfishness", to mean any egoistic act or any altruistic act that
has
>>an egoistic motive.
>
>You attack a Randish strawman.

 I don't think so.

>I have no idea, but I suspect Rand was attacking Catholic's or
>Jew's perpetual guilt trips; the need to make a doormat out of
>yourself; the Joan of Arc thing.

 Joan of Arc was the very opposite of a doormat and was an archetype of
what I mean by selfishness: she fought courageously for _her own_
values.

  My wild guess is; she had
>some bad experiences with it growing up. She turned that into
>a monster by assuming the whole world was that way.  You're;
>"finally", above suggests you may have a similar world view. 
>
>But the objective fact is; the dictionary says
>"selfish"; is caring *only* for oneself.  Rand
>explains clearly; that is the moral criterion.
>
>Below, you list some examples of how altruism have
>been abused, often under selfish false pretenses:
>
>> Communists demand that you give up all your
>>property and time to the state or the commune and denounce you as
>>selfish if you refuse. Nazis demand that everything be sacrificed to
>>"the purity of the race". The "moral majority" constantly denounce
>>women as selfish who demand the same choices in career, sexuality,
>>etc., that men have and who refuse to conform to "traditional family
>>roles". Anti-porn pseudo-"feminists"

 Note: by _pseudo_, I mean that they reinforce all the very _worst_
stereotypes about women (as passive, weak, helpless "oppressed
victims", ad nauseum).

 demand that men (and women too)
>>give up their selfish sexual desires. Guilt-manipulators whine:
"You're
>>so selfish. You won't give up your happiness to serve _me_." or "Who
>>are you to hold on to your own beliefs. How can you be right and
>>everyone else wrong? You're so selfish."
>
>And everything from God, to apple pie and mother's milk
>have been abused in the same way by despots.  Does this
>mean that because they been used as tools of evil, that
>the concepts are evil?  That is Rand's unreasonable argument.

>> You yourself have,
>>unfortunately, written post after post saying that the individual
>>exists for the sake of the species, which I flat deny.
>
>And I flat out deny saying that.  What I said was, in conflict
>resolution, human civilization and the human species takes
>ultimate precedence over an individual's whims or
>convenience.  Self defense.  Rand's strawmen would have me
>goose-stepping into your livingroom or bedroom to GET you.
> Very emotional, very frightening images these guys paint.
>They feed on that fear.  But where's the beef?  Where's the
>logic?
>
>> Ayn Rand once gave an excellent illustration of exactly what I mean
by
>>selfishness: If you had to choose between saving your wife's life and
>>saving the lives of ten other women, the selfish man would save his
>>wife. I'm proud to be selfish.
>
>Appealing to the low emotions is one of Rand's trademarks.
>Notice your (Rand's) logical disjunction.  You move
>seamlessly from normal behavior (saving your wife) to being
>proud to be concerned ONLY with yourself.  She is quite
>tricky.  Do you see the logical fallacy?    

 I don't accept the premise that love for one's spouse is in any way
"lower" than love for ten total strangers.

>>>>-- 
>>>>sma4@ix.netcom.com
>>>>"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
>>>> wanting to be by oneself,
>>>> being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich
>>Nietzsche
>>>
>>>Some have said that Nietzsche is real philosophy, and Randism
>>>is akin to dittoheadism.
>
>> I'm not a dittohead. I think for myself.
>
>Laughingggggg!!!   It probably means nothing here,
>but that is what all Rush's dittohead parrots say. 
>He tells them how original they are.   

 Rush Limbaugh is a clown and phony with his head stuck up the rectal
canals of Dornan, Helms, Pat Robertson, etc., all of whom I despise.

>>(I do prefer Nietzsche to
>>Rand, as he was a more complex thinker in many ways.)
>
>It's been said that Randism is just a fancy way to
>say; "if it feels good, do it."   That morality has
>always had a following.  Like Rush, she wraps not-so-
>noble ideas in noble sounding words and concepts.
>That also happens in every nasty war.  
>
>>>  Philosophy for those not able to discern
>>>her rhetorical tricks.  I've said that Randism is Limbaughtomyville
>>>served in a book.  Populist cults that derive their popularity  via
>>>very good "approach and presentation", the pitch.
>>>
>>>Some say this is good, she brings philosophy to Joe Sixpack, and
>>>when they grow philosophically, they will see her for what she is.
>>>My concern is for those who approach her dogmatically, as a cult.
>
>> I don't.
>
>You do seem to be searching for the truth, and speaking
>your mind rather than acting dogmatically.  That is not
>very common.
>
>>>Almost by definition, they will NOT seek out other philosophies,
>>>and will not achieve this growth.  They will be stuck in the mean,
>>>egoistic world of a spoiled child..
>>>
>>>Many religions bad-mouth other religions.  Rand has made some
>>>pretty wild and unsupported disparaging remarks about most other
>>>philosophers.  Both cases I see as the preservation mechanisms of
>>>dogma.
>>>
>>>>>>>>-  Ayn Rand summarized her philosophy in three words:
>>>>>>>>-  reason, egoism, freedom.
>>>
>>>Yet that is not what we see when we look at her followers.  We see
>>>dogma, egoism, and all the freedom you can rent or buy. 
>>>
>>>>>>>>- She summarized the antithesis of her
>>>>>>>>-  philosophy in three words as well: mysticism, altruism,
force.
>>>
>>>--Doug
>>>
>>>Re: In a Libertarian world, Earth is scraped bare for the dollar
>>>  "In a Libertarian world, the right to pollute can be
>>>      purchased by the Rich Boys.  And why not?" 
>>>      ---  Lazarus.Long, 31 Aug 96 16:20:50  ---
>
>      Re: Morality of Taxation (from the beginning)
>"I am my own god."  -- Randist; Nicholas Rich, 04 Sep 96 04:21:03 GMT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Views of life:  <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
>Religious:      God created Man in his own image.
>Atheist:        Man created God in his own image.
>"Objectivist":  Ayn Rand created God in my image.  Nee-ner, nee-ner.
>
>
>
>

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Fri Oct 11 10:48:32 PDT 1996
Article: 480836 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.radio,talk.politics.theory,talk.politics.republican,talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,ca.politics,az.politics,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.libertarian,alt.politics.correct,alt.philosophy.objectivism,alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,alt.society.conservatism,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,
Subject: Re: 50 States or 50 Dictatorships? (why did we fight the Civil War?)
Date: 11 Oct 1996 04:41:06 GMT
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 _I_ own my life. State legislatures don't own it.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct 12 12:51:28 PDT 1996
Article: 481379 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce,soc.men,soc.couples,rec.org.mensa,soc.women,alt.feminism,alt.mens-rights,alt.politics.sex,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Women....Their own worst enemy!  INFERIOR???
Date: 11 Oct 1996 22:31:34 GMT
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In <325E79CE.65D8@nwark.com> "TJ \"Spark\" Miller jr."
 writes: 
>
>Kiralynne wrote:
>> 
>> mark@leasion.demon.co.uk (Mark Evans) wrote:
>> >Bryan McGuire (rmcguir@hubcap.clemson.edu) wrote:
>> >: Kiralynne  wrote:
>> >:
>> >: >Although 'civilization' dates back more than ten thousand
>> >: >years.. no evidence of women ever being in charge. Looking
>> >: >at all the messes in history.. maybe it should be our turn.
>
>Cleopatra, The various Queens of England (From Victoria on...):
>
>Nope, no female leaders here...

 Queen Hatshepsut (at the height of Egypt's empire) was more powerful
than Cleopatra. In England, there was Queen Elizabeth I, Mary Tudor,
and Mary Stuart. Also Catherine of Russia....and so on....
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct 12 12:51:29 PDT 1996
Article: 481411 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.support.abortion,talk.abortion,us.politics.abortion,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Chris Lie-man lies again
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In <53li73$chc@news.tamu.edu> kjackson@cs.tamu.edu (Keith E Jackson)
writes: 

>>Btw II, this all started when PJ posted an article about an Idaho
>>prosecutor who was throwing pregnant teenage girls in jail for
>>fornication.  This person didn't bother to hand out the same
>>consequence to the boys who impregnated them.  Some people just love
>>the smell of double standards in the morning.

 A double-standard. Myself, I think it stinks. What do pro-lifers
think? Are they for it or against it? Hidden agenda behind the pro-life
movement: anti-female-sexuality?
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Mon Oct 14 22:59:48 PDT 1996
Article: 99443 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
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Subject: Re: sounds like a hate filled republican
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Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.journalism:57332 alt.sex:187986 news.groups:160552 alt.sex.masturbation:43855 alt.censorship:105425 alt.drugs.pot:30563 alt.drugs:117325 alt.hemp:24372 alt.sex.anal:13065 alt.sex.breast:22015 alt.sex.first-time:3569 alt.sex.movies:63846 alt.sex.wanted:47442 talk.politics.misc:484168 alt.sex.magazines:5973 alt.sex.necrophilia:1368 alt.beer:26696 talk.philosophy.humanism:7617 talk.rape:19414 talk.abortion:189056 alt.party:3556 alt.politics.homosexuality:119142 alt.skinheads:39764 alt.sex.services:22844 alt.games.apogee:4138 alt.2600:110889 alt.abortion.inequity:59329 alt.activism:83231 alt.aol-sucks:33732 alt.business:11167 alt.christnet:114497 alt.conspiracy:99443 alt.cult-movies:80089 alt.dear.whitehouse:31523 alt.feminism:130663 alt.forsale:4585 alt.personals:119515 alt.president.clinton:103567 alt.punk:42301 alt.showbiz.gossip:33057 talk.origins:154855 alt.sex.pictures:38973 alt.sex.pictures.female:30802 alt.sex.pictures.male:15441

In <3261b827.16606591@nntp.ix.netcom.com> tamig@e-z.net (Tami ) writes:

>
>Kenneth Gore  wrote:
>
>>I think that you hit the nail smack on the head there. We MUST
>>reestablish respect for religious beliefs, family values, 
>
>Whose family values? Yours? ROFL&L&L&L&L. Advocating the death or
>pregnant women is NOT family values.

 Definitely not anything remotely compatible with any of MY values.
Only a scum would advocate it.

 What we need to do is advocate
>that families

 and individuals.

 decide their values - not church or state.

 Exactly.

>>and the rights of individuals, 

 Hypocrite.

>Again ROFL&L&L&L&L. Either you're contradicting yourself or you're
>admitting that you believe that women are not individuals.

 Exactly.

>>especially the rights of the unborn to be born at all costs, 
>
>z/e/f's don't have rights. 

 Women do.

>>and I think that we'll achieve those goals.
>
>Of what? Living in a new nazi era?

 Kenneth Gore is a lying, woman-hating jerk.

>     Tami
>
>Any idiot can face a crisis - it's this day-to-day living that wears
you out.
>
>     - Anton Chekhov

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Mon Oct 14 23:01:11 PDT 1996
Article: 39764 of alt.skinheads
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!news.mathworks.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.games.duke3d,alt.journalism,alt.sex,news.groups,alt.sex.masturbation,alt.censorship,alt.drugs.pot,alt.drugs,alt.hemp,alt.sex.anal,alt.sex.breast,alt.sex.erotica,alt.sex.first-time,alt.sex.gangbang,alt.sex.girls,alt.sex.movies,alt.sex.oral,alt.sex.wanted,talk.politics.misc,alt.sex.magazines,alt.sex.marketplace,alt.sex.necrophilia,alt.sex.orgy,alt.beer,talk.philosophy.humanism,talk.rape,talk.abortion,alt.party,alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.skinheads,uk.politics,alt.sex.services,alt.games.apogee,alt.2600,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.activism,alt.aol-sucks,alt.business,alt.censorship,alt.christnet,alt.conspiracy,alt.cult-movies,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.feminism,alt.forsale,alt.misc,alt.personals,alt.president.clinton,alt.punk,alt.showbiz.gossip,talk.abortion,talk.origins,alt.sex.pictures,alt.sex.pictures.female,alt.sex.pictures.male
Subject: Re: sounds like a hate filled republican
Date: 15 Oct 1996 00:54:30 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <53unc6$iea@dfw-ixnews10.ix.netcom.com>
References: <3260428F.C05@niggers.to.hell> <53ohn8$ir4@eri.erinet.com>  <53p6s2$38k_002@asd123.enter.net> <53pbff$pq1@sjx-ixn5.ix.netcom.com> <53qdkr$cd9@news.e-tex.com> <326528ba.144124376@news.netonecom.net> <32616A3E.2870@ianet.net> <3261b827.16606591@nntp.ix.netcom.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hay-ca1-20.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Oct 14  7:54:30 PM CDT 1996
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In <3261b827.16606591@nntp.ix.netcom.com> tamig@e-z.net (Tami ) writes:

>
>Kenneth Gore  wrote:
>
>>I think that you hit the nail smack on the head there. We MUST
>>reestablish respect for religious beliefs, family values, 
>
>Whose family values? Yours? ROFL&L&L&L&L. Advocating the death or
>pregnant women is NOT family values.

 Definitely not anything remotely compatible with any of MY values.
Only a scum would advocate it.

 What we need to do is advocate
>that families

 and individuals.

 decide their values - not church or state.

 Exactly.

>>and the rights of individuals, 

 Hypocrite.

>Again ROFL&L&L&L&L. Either you're contradicting yourself or you're
>admitting that you believe that women are not individuals.

 Exactly.

>>especially the rights of the unborn to be born at all costs, 
>
>z/e/f's don't have rights. 

 Women do.

>>and I think that we'll achieve those goals.
>
>Of what? Living in a new nazi era?

 Kenneth Gore is a lying, woman-hating jerk.

>     Tami
>
>Any idiot can face a crisis - it's this day-to-day living that wears
you out.
>
>     - Anton Chekhov

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 08:53:41 PDT 1996
Article: 99536 of alt.conspiracy
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!noc.van.hookup.net!nic.mtl.hookup.net!rcogate.rco.qc.ca!n3ott.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!n1van.istar!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.mathworks.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!newsgate.compuserve.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.games.duke3d,alt.journalism,alt.sex,news.groups,alt.sex.masturbation,alt.censorship,alt.drugs.pot,alt.drugs,alt.hemp,alt.sex.anal,alt.sex.breast,alt.sex.erotica,alt.sex.first-time,alt.sex.gangbang,alt.sex.girls,alt.sex.movies,alt.sex.oral,alt.sex.wanted,talk.politics.misc,alt.sex.stories,alt.sex.homosexual,alt.sex.magazines,alt.sex.marketplace,alt.sex.necrophilia,alt.sex.orgy,alt.beer,talk.philosophy.humanism,talk.rape,talk.abortion,alt.party,alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.skinheads,rec.sport.basketball.college,uk.politics,alt.sex.services,alt.games.apogee,alt.2600,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.activism,alt.aol-sucks,alt.business,alt.censorship,alt.christnet,alt.conspiracy,alt.cult-movies,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.feminism,alt.forsale,alt.guitar,alt.kids-talk,alt.misc,alt.personals,alt.president.clinton,alt.punk,alt.showbiz.gossip,talk.abortion,talk.origins,alt.sex.pictures,alt.sex.pictures.female,alt.sex.pictures.male
Subject: Re: I RAPED A NIGGER CHILD!!
Date: 15 Oct 1996 04:26:21 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <53v3pd$7bn@dfw-ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>
References: <3262D2A4.2D73@off.asshole> <53u339$9it@natasha.rmii.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hay-ca1-20.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Oct 14 11:26:21 PM CDT 1996
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 GO TO THE ELECTRIC CHAIR, RAPISTS AND SCUM!! GO TO THE ELECTRIC
CHAIR!!
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 09:35:16 PDT 1996
Article: 39801 of alt.skinheads
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!noc.van.hookup.net!nic.mtl.hookup.net!rcogate.rco.qc.ca!n3ott.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!n1van.istar!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.mathworks.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!newsgate.compuserve.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.games.duke3d,alt.journalism,alt.sex,news.groups,alt.sex.masturbation,alt.censorship,alt.drugs.pot,alt.drugs,alt.hemp,alt.sex.anal,alt.sex.breast,alt.sex.erotica,alt.sex.first-time,alt.sex.gangbang,alt.sex.girls,alt.sex.movies,alt.sex.oral,alt.sex.wanted,talk.politics.misc,alt.sex.stories,alt.sex.homosexual,alt.sex.magazines,alt.sex.marketplace,alt.sex.necrophilia,alt.sex.orgy,alt.beer,talk.philosophy.humanism,talk.rape,talk.abortion,alt.party,alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.skinheads,rec.sport.basketball.college,uk.politics,alt.sex.services,alt.games.apogee,alt.2600,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.activism,alt.aol-sucks,alt.business,alt.censorship,alt.christnet,alt.conspiracy,alt.cult-movies,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.feminism,alt.forsale,alt.guitar,alt.kids-talk,alt.misc,alt.personals,alt.president.clinton,alt.punk,alt.showbiz.gossip,talk.abortion,talk.origins,alt.sex.pictures,alt.sex.pictures.female,alt.sex.pictures.male
Subject: Re: I RAPED A NIGGER CHILD!!
Date: 15 Oct 1996 04:26:21 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <53v3pd$7bn@dfw-ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>
References: <3262D2A4.2D73@off.asshole> <53u339$9it@natasha.rmii.com>
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X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Oct 14 11:26:21 PM CDT 1996
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 GO TO THE ELECTRIC CHAIR, RAPISTS AND SCUM!! GO TO THE ELECTRIC
CHAIR!!
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 09:40:47 PDT 1996
Article: 105425 of alt.censorship
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!news.mathworks.com!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.games.duke3d,alt.journalism,alt.sex,news.groups,alt.sex.masturbation,alt.censorship,alt.drugs.pot,alt.drugs,alt.hemp,alt.sex.anal,alt.sex.breast,alt.sex.erotica,alt.sex.first-time,alt.sex.gangbang,alt.sex.girls,alt.sex.movies,alt.sex.oral,alt.sex.wanted,talk.politics.misc,alt.sex.magazines,alt.sex.marketplace,alt.sex.necrophilia,alt.sex.orgy,alt.beer,talk.philosophy.humanism,talk.rape,talk.abortion,alt.party,alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.skinheads,uk.politics,alt.sex.services,alt.games.apogee,alt.2600,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.activism,alt.aol-sucks,alt.business,alt.censorship,alt.christnet,alt.conspiracy,alt.cult-movies,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.feminism,alt.forsale,alt.misc,alt.personals,alt.president.clinton,alt.punk,alt.showbiz.gossip,talk.abortion,talk.origins,alt.sex.pictures,alt.sex.pictures.female,alt.sex.pictures.male
Subject: Re: sounds like a hate filled republican
Date: 15 Oct 1996 00:54:30 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 57
Message-ID: <53unc6$iea@dfw-ixnews10.ix.netcom.com>
References: <3260428F.C05@niggers.to.hell> <53ohn8$ir4@eri.erinet.com>  <53p6s2$38k_002@asd123.enter.net> <53pbff$pq1@sjx-ixn5.ix.netcom.com> <53qdkr$cd9@news.e-tex.com> <326528ba.144124376@news.netonecom.net> <32616A3E.2870@ianet.net> <3261b827.16606591@nntp.ix.netcom.com>
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X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Oct 14  7:54:30 PM CDT 1996
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In <3261b827.16606591@nntp.ix.netcom.com> tamig@e-z.net (Tami ) writes:

>
>Kenneth Gore  wrote:
>
>>I think that you hit the nail smack on the head there. We MUST
>>reestablish respect for religious beliefs, family values, 
>
>Whose family values? Yours? ROFL&L&L&L&L. Advocating the death or
>pregnant women is NOT family values.

 Definitely not anything remotely compatible with any of MY values.
Only a scum would advocate it.

 What we need to do is advocate
>that families

 and individuals.

 decide their values - not church or state.

 Exactly.

>>and the rights of individuals, 

 Hypocrite.

>Again ROFL&L&L&L&L. Either you're contradicting yourself or you're
>admitting that you believe that women are not individuals.

 Exactly.

>>especially the rights of the unborn to be born at all costs, 
>
>z/e/f's don't have rights. 

 Women do.

>>and I think that we'll achieve those goals.
>
>Of what? Living in a new nazi era?

 Kenneth Gore is a lying, woman-hating jerk.

>     Tami
>
>Any idiot can face a crisis - it's this day-to-day living that wears
you out.
>
>     - Anton Chekhov

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 09:40:48 PDT 1996
Article: 105459 of alt.censorship
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!noc.van.hookup.net!nic.mtl.hookup.net!rcogate.rco.qc.ca!n3ott.istar!ott.istar!istar.net!van.istar!west.istar!n1van.istar!van-bc!news.mindlink.net!uniserve!news.sol.net!newspump.sol.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news.mathworks.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!newsgate.compuserve.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.games.duke3d,alt.journalism,alt.sex,news.groups,alt.sex.masturbation,alt.censorship,alt.drugs.pot,alt.drugs,alt.hemp,alt.sex.anal,alt.sex.breast,alt.sex.erotica,alt.sex.first-time,alt.sex.gangbang,alt.sex.girls,alt.sex.movies,alt.sex.oral,alt.sex.wanted,talk.politics.misc,alt.sex.stories,alt.sex.homosexual,alt.sex.magazines,alt.sex.marketplace,alt.sex.necrophilia,alt.sex.orgy,alt.beer,talk.philosophy.humanism,talk.rape,talk.abortion,alt.party,alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.skinheads,rec.sport.basketball.college,uk.politics,alt.sex.services,alt.games.apogee,alt.2600,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.activism,alt.aol-sucks,alt.business,alt.censorship,alt.christnet,alt.conspiracy,alt.cult-movies,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.feminism,alt.forsale,alt.guitar,alt.kids-talk,alt.misc,alt.personals,alt.president.clinton,alt.punk,alt.showbiz.gossip,talk.abortion,talk.origins,alt.sex.pictures,alt.sex.pictures.female,alt.sex.pictures.male
Subject: Re: I RAPED A NIGGER CHILD!!
Date: 15 Oct 1996 04:26:21 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 8
Message-ID: <53v3pd$7bn@dfw-ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>
References: <3262D2A4.2D73@off.asshole> <53u339$9it@natasha.rmii.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: hay-ca1-20.ix.netcom.com
X-NETCOM-Date: Mon Oct 14 11:26:21 PM CDT 1996
Xref: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca alt.journalism:57367 alt.sex:188023 news.groups:160594 alt.sex.masturbation:43884 alt.censorship:105459 alt.drugs.pot:30590 alt.drugs:117355 alt.hemp:24400 alt.sex.anal:13096 alt.sex.breast:22043 alt.sex.first-time:3597 alt.sex.movies:63876 alt.sex.wanted:47468 talk.politics.misc:484391 alt.sex.stories:83995 alt.sex.homosexual:15122 alt.sex.magazines:5997 alt.sex.necrophilia:1395 alt.beer:26720 talk.philosophy.humanism:7643 talk.rape:19439 talk.abortion:189106 alt.party:3580 alt.politics.homosexuality:119186 alt.skinheads:39801 rec.sport.basketball.college:111893 alt.sex.services:22869 alt.games.apogee:4161 alt.2600:110916 alt.abortion.inequity:59358 alt.activism:83339 alt.aol-sucks:33754 alt.business:11191 alt.christnet:114557 alt.conspiracy:99536 alt.cult-movies:80114 alt.dear.whitehouse:31559 alt.feminism:130701 alt.forsale:4609 alt.guitar:58847 alt.kids-talk:62279 alt.personals:119541 alt.president.clinton:103642 alt.punk:42328 alt.showbiz.gossip:33079 talk.origins:154918 alt.sex.pictures:38998 alt.sex.pictures.female:30827 alt.sex.pictures.male:15467

 GO TO THE ELECTRIC CHAIR, RAPISTS AND SCUM!! GO TO THE ELECTRIC
CHAIR!!
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 10:35:05 PDT 1996
Article: 484168 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.games.duke3d,alt.journalism,alt.sex,news.groups,alt.sex.masturbation,alt.censorship,alt.drugs.pot,alt.drugs,alt.hemp,alt.sex.anal,alt.sex.breast,alt.sex.erotica,alt.sex.first-time,alt.sex.gangbang,alt.sex.girls,alt.sex.movies,alt.sex.oral,alt.sex.wanted,talk.politics.misc,alt.sex.magazines,alt.sex.marketplace,alt.sex.necrophilia,alt.sex.orgy,alt.beer,talk.philosophy.humanism,talk.rape,talk.abortion,alt.party,alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.skinheads,uk.politics,alt.sex.services,alt.games.apogee,alt.2600,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.activism,alt.aol-sucks,alt.business,alt.censorship,alt.christnet,alt.conspiracy,alt.cult-movies,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.feminism,alt.forsale,alt.misc,alt.personals,alt.president.clinton,alt.punk,alt.showbiz.gossip,talk.abortion,talk.origins,alt.sex.pictures,alt.sex.pictures.female,alt.sex.pictures.male
Subject: Re: sounds like a hate filled republican
Date: 15 Oct 1996 00:54:30 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In <3261b827.16606591@nntp.ix.netcom.com> tamig@e-z.net (Tami ) writes:

>
>Kenneth Gore  wrote:
>
>>I think that you hit the nail smack on the head there. We MUST
>>reestablish respect for religious beliefs, family values, 
>
>Whose family values? Yours? ROFL&L&L&L&L. Advocating the death or
>pregnant women is NOT family values.

 Definitely not anything remotely compatible with any of MY values.
Only a scum would advocate it.

 What we need to do is advocate
>that families

 and individuals.

 decide their values - not church or state.

 Exactly.

>>and the rights of individuals, 

 Hypocrite.

>Again ROFL&L&L&L&L. Either you're contradicting yourself or you're
>admitting that you believe that women are not individuals.

 Exactly.

>>especially the rights of the unborn to be born at all costs, 
>
>z/e/f's don't have rights. 

 Women do.

>>and I think that we'll achieve those goals.
>
>Of what? Living in a new nazi era?

 Kenneth Gore is a lying, woman-hating jerk.

>     Tami
>
>Any idiot can face a crisis - it's this day-to-day living that wears
you out.
>
>     - Anton Chekhov

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 10:35:07 PDT 1996
Article: 484323 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce,soc.men,soc.couples,rec.org.mensa,soc.women,alt.feminism,alt.mens-rights,alt.politics.sex,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Female Rapists
Date: 15 Oct 1996 02:26:13 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 26
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In <53td5o$fe0@sjx-ixn4.ix.netcom.com> leftylu@ix.netcom.com(Carol Ann
Hemingway) writes: 
>
>In <53s5mv$8at@uruguay.earthlink.net> Intolger (1@2.3) writes: 
>>
>(edit)
>
> Women's sexual shame is their problem, though. I'm more
>>interested in rescuing and protecting children from the destructive
>behaviors>of women and feminism. 
>
>    ------
>    Ok, I'm curious enough to ask....what IS women's sexual shame;  is
>it a "shame" that they HAVE sex, or a shame that they ENJOY it?
>
>Lefty

 _I_ say women should be selfishly proud to have and to enjoy sex -- as
I am.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 10:35:08 PDT 1996
Article: 484391 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
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Subject: Re: I RAPED A NIGGER CHILD!!
Date: 15 Oct 1996 04:26:21 GMT
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 GO TO THE ELECTRIC CHAIR, RAPISTS AND SCUM!! GO TO THE ELECTRIC
CHAIR!!
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 14:53:05 PDT 1996
Article: 82926 of soc.culture.jewish
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,talk.abortion,alt.abortion,soc.women
Subject: Re: Gore says abortions are done by 'the Jews.'
Date: 15 Oct 1996 19:08:06 GMT
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In <53p3b1$ied@huron.eel.ufl.edu> afn03488@freenet2.afn.org (Steven T.
Gladin) writes: 
>
>In , chrisl@minn.net 
>(Chris Lyman) wrote:
>
>CL> dhudson@vni.net (Dave Hudson) wrote:
>
>CL> # > It's a pizza when it goes into the oven. There's a box in
>CL> # > my freezer which has "Three Cheese Pizzas" on the outside.
>CL> # > It doesn't say "Three Potential Cheese Pizzas."
>
>CL> # Here, here! I was wondering when somebody was going to say that!
>
>CL> Well, what if you make a pizza from scratch instead of buying one
>CL> frozen?
>
>Chris, it seems the pro-LIARS are so hung up on not doing the nasty
>that they get their kids from the cryogenic section of the fertility
>store.

 Har! Har! Good description of many of them.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 15 18:05:53 PDT 1996
Article: 485029 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion,alt.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.religion.christian,rec.org.mensa,talk.politics.misc,talk.religion.misc,alt.christnet
Subject: Re: RELIGIOUS BIGOTS
Date: 15 Oct 1996 20:51:42 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In  heatscan@kalama.com
(Gerhard N. Thoen) writes: 
>
>In article <53er3n$fsg@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>, xona
 wrote:
>
>> Religious Bigots
>> 
>> Pat Robertson> Jerry fallwell> gary Bauer> Ralph Reed> Chuck Coleson
>> James Dobson> Phyilis Schlafly> Donald Wildmon> Alan Keyes> C.
Dolores Tucker
>> Charles  Grassley> Robert K. Dornan> Pat Buchanan> Bob Peters
>
>Dear xana, Please add my name to your list.  I will be greatful to
know
>that I would be in Godly company here-for I know I will be in God's
>company there. And with such persons as listed by you there will be no
>shame when I meet Him.
>These people are fine, moral and God fearing.  They have Hope, Faith
and
>Charity. They not only know what they stand for but let those around
them
>know as well.  You on the other hand apparently hate them for
>that-pity....
>God will forgive you-and He does love you. 
>Regards, Gerhard

 They're totalitarian jerks who would extinguish _my_ freedoms. They're
_my_ enemies and I don't profess to love them or forgive them. You can
have them.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sat Oct 19 15:05:18 PDT 1996
Article: 164766 of control
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
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Spam cancel. Original Subject: Re: Have we really got this straight in our heads?


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sun Oct 20 11:22:36 PDT 1996
Article: 488286 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion,alt.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.religion.christian,rec.org.mensa,talk.politics.misc,talk.religion.misc,alt.christnet
Subject: Re: RELIGIOUS BIGOTS
Date: 19 Oct 1996 22:28:02 GMT
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In 
justpete@castles.com (Peter Bradt) writes: 
>
>In article <53er3n$fsg@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>, xona
 wrote:
>
>> Religious Bigots
>> 
>> Pat Robertson
>> Jerry fallwell
>> gary bauer
>> Ralph reed
>> Chuck Coleson
>> James Dobson
>> Phyilis Schlafly
>> Donald Wildmon
>> Alan Keyes
>> C. Dolores Tucker
>> Charles  Grassley
>> Robert K. Dornan
>> Pat Buchanan
>> Bob Peters
>
>Add Laura Schlessinger to this list

 Jesse Helms, too.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sun Oct 20 11:22:39 PDT 1996
Article: 488331 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.abortion,alt.abortion,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.religion.christian,rec.org.mensa,talk.politics.misc,talk.religion.misc,alt.christnet
Subject: Re: RELIGIOUS BIGOTS
Date: 19 Oct 1996 23:37:42 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In <32679004.7904@ix.netcom.com> Bill Renfro 
writes: 
>
>kerro wrote:
>> 
>> justpete@castles.com (Peter Bradt) wrote:
>> >In article <53er3n$fsg@nnrp1.news.primenet.com>, xona
 wrote:
>> >
>> >> Religious Bigots
>> >>
>> >> Pat Robertson
>> >> Jerry fallwell
>> >> gary bauer
>> >> Ralph reed
>> >> Chuck Coleson
>> >> James Dobson
>> >> Phyilis Schlafly
>> >> Donald Wildmon
>> >> Alan Keyes
>> >> C. Dolores Tucker
>> >> Charles  Grassley
>> >> Robert K. Dornan
>> >> Pat Buchanan
>> >> Bob Peters
>> >
>> >Add Laura Schlessinger to this list
>> 
>> Also, whatever happened to Oral Roberts? (He was given the bum's
rush
>> from Australia as far back as the late 50s/early 60s - at least one
>> thing we've done right.) I presume he's still around - god hasn't
claimed
>> him yet...?
>
>
>Forgive me if this has already been addressed but I don't understand. 
>Is this a list of people who are bigotted against people of religion,
or
>people of religion who are bigotted?
>
>Bill

 They're people who are bigoted generally, and particularly are bigoted
against any religion that doesn't assume that there can only be one God
-- a MALE God.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sun Oct 20 14:36:01 PDT 1996
Article: 84357 of soc.culture.jewish
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish,talk.abortion,alt.abortion,soc.women
Subject: Re: Gore says abortions are done by 'the Jews.'
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X-NETCOM-Date: Sun Oct 20 11:22:26 AM CDT 1996
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In <3269EB1C.408E@prodigy.net> IRISHLASS72 
writes: 
>
>Mike Pelletier wrote:
>
>> To the abortion-rights proponents, this unique, individual human
>> organism is not as important as the mother's right to choose whether
>> to continue to nourish that human.
>> 
>> To the abortion opponents, the importance of that unique human
>> organism's life does not hinge on how far along in its growth and
>> development it is.
>> 
>>         -Mike Pelletier.
>
>Well, you've taken what is an extremely complex and emotionally
charged
>issue: ABORTION, and summed it up quite well. :)  I guess when it all
>comes down to it that's how most people feel.  If you are pro-choice,
>you feel the woman's rights and life and circumstances, decisions,
etc.
>supercede those of the baby, if you're not pro-choice you don't care
>about the woman, you just want to save that baby growing inside of
her.
>;)

 You got it! To the pro-lifers, a woman is just a semi-invisible
_wrapping_ around that cute little "baby" -- a wrapping that
inconveniently walks, talks, thinks, and actually has the audacity to
think she has rights of her own, equal to any man (horrors! can't allow
that!), and even equal to a zygote.
-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Mon Oct 21 07:35:17 PDT 1996
Article: 101797 of alt.conspiracy
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.games.duke3d,alt.journalism,alt.sex,news.groups,alt.sex.masturbation,alt.censorship,alt.drugs.pot,alt.drugs,alt.hemp,alt.sex.anal,alt.sex.breast,alt.sex.erotica,alt.sex.first-time,alt.sex.gangbang,alt.sex.girls,alt.sex.movies,alt.sex.oral,alt.sex.wanted,talk.politics.misc,alt.sex.magazines,alt.sex.marketplace,alt.sex.necrophilia,alt.sex.orgy,alt.beer,talk.philosophy.humanism,talk.rape,talk.abortion,alt.party,alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.skinheads,uk.politics,alt.sex.services,alt.games.apogee,alt.2600,alt.abortion.inequity,alt.activism,alt.aol-sucks,alt.business,alt.censorship,alt.christnet,alt.conspiracy,alt.cult-movies,alt.dear.whitehouse,alt.feminism,alt.forsale,alt.misc,alt.personals,alt.president.clinton,alt.punk,alt.showbiz.gossip,talk.abort
Subject: Re: People who pray to God for you to GET A LIFE
Date: 21 Oct 1996 06:59:19 GMT
Organization: Netcom
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In <54dl3n$a8g@news1.randomc.com> OBI WAN writes: 
>
>I WISH THERE MORE PEOPLE LIKE YOU IN THIS WORLD!! 
>THERE ARE TOO MANY RELIGOUS FREAKS IN THIS WORLD THAT ARE ALWAYS
>TRYING IN SAY WHAT OTHER PEOPLE CAN AND CAN'T DO....
>THESE PEOPLE SHOULD BE SHOT!!!!

 I AGREE!

>kendalls@ix.netcom.com(MLW) wrote:
>
>
>>Newsgroups are for intelligent discussions (?!?!) or for FUN ....  
>>Not for your hateful, ignorant crap.
>
>
>

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 24 09:56:53 PDT 1996
Article: 491415 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!feed1.news.erols.com!news.enteract.com!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce,soc.men,soc.couples,rec.org.mensa,soc.women,alt.feminism,alt.mens-rights,alt.politics.sex,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Women....Their own worst enemy!  INFERIOR???
Date: 24 Oct 1996 03:19:37 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 44
Message-ID: <54mn89$cms@dfw-ixnews11.ix.netcom.com>
References: <535ooq$7tj@apcserv2.apcnet.com> <536370$1il@dfw-ixnews9.ix.netcom.com>  <538stv$cgs@dfw-ixnews6.ix.netcom.com> <539b5e$k00@sjx-ixn6.ix.netcom.com> <539cn5$b6i@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com> <32589211.4783317@news.on-ramp.net> <53c7ak$pe0@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com> <53dgll$bqe@nntp.pe.net> <53g4i5$efe@hubcap.clemson.edu> <326E24A5.1955@2.3> 
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In 
harper@bcsupernet.com (Meaghan Walker) writes: 
>
>In article <326E24A5.1955@2.3>, 1@2.3 says...
>> Bryan McGuire wrote:
>> > 
>> > Kiralynne  wrote:
>> > 
>> > >Although 'civilization' dates back more than ten thousand
>> > >years.. no evidence of women ever being in charge. Looking
>> > >at all the messes in history.. maybe it should be our turn.
>> > 
>> > I would think that someone who was so proud of her heritage would
know
>> > something about it.  I am utterly convinced you are not Native
>> > American.
>> 
>> Not only that, but she is one who dwells on the negative. What about
ALL
>> of the RIGHT things in the world, and history. I might also add that
>> some women HAVE been in power in recent history in other countries,
and
>> some of those have actually shown that they do an equal job, and
some
>> worse. None have shown that they could do a better one.
>> 
>
>Oh I dont know - she might be First Nations, She might just be totally

>ignorant of the several different tribes of First nations people from
all 
>along the West Coast who were in fact Matriarchal.
>
>Meaghan Walker

 It's a lie that women are inherently more "peaceful" than men. Women
can be as violent and warlike as men -- and _should_ be.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Sun Oct 27 12:17:57 PST 1996
Article: 493929 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.bc.net!nntp.portal.ca!newsfeed.direct.ca!op.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!uunet!in3.uu.net!news.tacom.army.mil!news.webspan.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: soc.men,rec.org.mensa,soc.women,alt.feminism,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Womyn's Rites
Date: 27 Oct 1996 04:36:24 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <54uos8$sbd@sjx-ixn7.ix.netcom.com>
References: <4vuant$5bl@dorsai.dorsai.org> <323FFCF0.496B@norfolk.infi.net> <51p7co$kbo@kira.peak.org> <32412566.4F07@garlic.com> <51s82i$khc@kira.peak.or <3242A97A.3F4F@utech.net> <1996Sep23.190418.17465@atl.com> <32494377.A9D@sunrem.com> <52btq1$frr@newshost.cyberramp.net> <52coau$8cg@news0-alterdial.uu.net> <52d2g8$fu7@newshost.cyberramp.net> <52dskd$8tn@news0-alterdial.uu.net> <52ea1r$erf@newshost.cyberramp.net> <52etil$2sk@news0-alterdial.uu.net> <52p368$md7@fnnews.fnal.gov> <52rafb$691@fnnews.fnal.go <53r39e$nga@sjx-ixn3.ix.netcom.com>  <32629f32.0@206.170.76.1> <3263E7C1.7587@2.4> <3263EA46.75ED@2.4> <326388e8.0@206.170.76.1> <3264F319.15F1@uokhsc.edu> <32649162.0@206.170.76.1> <3267CFFA.7AB6@2.com> <845896426.494861@inet_srv> <326D25D2.B62@myself.i> <326cf173.0@206.170.76.1> <32723222.4756@chem-gharbison.unl.edu>
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In <32723222.4756@chem-gharbison.unl.edu> Gerry Harbison
 writes: 
>
>Kiralynne wrote:
>> You have committed a logical oxymoron. 
>
>That's very funny! I love self-referential humor!
>
>> I indicated
>> bills are examined for constitutional compliance.
>> Staff members will pass an opinion it is. A bill
>> is signed into law with the majority feeling it is
>> constitutional. Later...
>
>And of course, an elected representative would *never*, *never* vote
for
>a politically popular bill, knowing full well it would be struck down
>later as unconstitional.
>
>
>> I could care less about CDA whatever the Hell those
>> initials stand for. I am talking reality here.
>
>Ah, I see your problem. You're utterly and completely ignorant. 
>
>The Communications Decency Act was coauthored by Senators Exon and
>Gorton, tacked on to the Telecommunications Bill, passed
overwhelmingly
>by both houses, signed by the president, and blocked under an
injnction
>from a federal act withing 2 days of becoming law. It is currently
>awaiting Supreme Court review.

 It means censorship of the net and I'm totally against it!!

>> 
>> Congresspersons and Representatives are very careful
>> in the wording of bills. Teams of experts follow its
>> every development. It is checked for language, legality,
>> constitutionality and political impact. That is the
>> nature of politics. That is the purpose of staff members.
>
>Oh God.
>
>> Talk reality and we will debate. Talk nit picking and
>> I will nail you for it everytime. Semantics don't work
>> on me. I am a Semantic Guerrilla.
>
>You are a blithering idiot.
>
>
>Gerry Harbison                   mailto:gerry@chem-gharbison.unl.edu 
>    http://chem-gharbison.unl.edu/harbison_group/harbison.html        
 
>"They are trying to make some people feel good by making other people
>feel bad, and if I were a boy, I'd move to New Guinea." 
>-- Sadie Stein, an eighth grader from New York, on Take Your Daughter
To
>Work Day.

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Mon Oct 28 08:29:31 PST 1996
Article: 494498 of talk.politics.misc
Path: nizkor.almanac.bc.ca!news.island.net!news.bctel.net!news.mag-net.com!aurora.cs.athabascau.ca!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.bc.net!arclight.uoregon.edu!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.webspan.net!ix.netcom.com!news
From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.abortion,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.current-events..usa,alt.politics.usa.constitution
Subject: Re: "ABOUT HARNESSING THE SUPREME COURT"
Date: 27 Oct 1996 23:55:37 GMT
Organization: Netcom
Lines: 427
Message-ID: <550spp$20l@dfw-ixnews10.ix.netcom.com>
References: <326F9119.2289@express-news.net> <54oqdd$r3n@nntp1.best.com> <32702AA3.1B2A@express-news.net> <54r5sn$eq@nntp1.best.com>
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In <54r5sn$eq@nntp1.best.com> kkelly1@nntp.best.com (Kevin Kelly)
writes: 

 One excellent post! You said it all, Mr. Kelly. We need men and women
like you on our courts standing up for our personal freedoms.

>Papa Jack (papajack@express-news.net) wrote:
>: Kevin Kelly wrote:
>: > 
>
>: Papa Jack comments:
>: Just when I made a firm decision not to bother with your 
>: posts anymore
>
>Poor Jack, you've made this claim many times and to many people, and
not
>followed through. It's one of the reasons you are laughed at.
>
>: because they were nothing but pure flames, 
>: you go and fool me.
>
>It's easy to fool a fool Jack.
>
>: This is the closest I've seen you come to actually discus-
>: sing the issues, KK.  I'm proud of you.  You're still a 
>: bit heavy on the sarcasm, but I've been known to singe my 
>: opponents at time too, so I'll forgo the criticism.
>
>IN a post where he criticizes. Most amusing.
>
>: Here's a challenge.  Can you discuss this post without a 
>: single flame?  I will do the same.  Stick strictly to the
>: issues.
>
>I will respond as I choose. If I wish to flame I shall. Don't like it?
Too
>bad.
>
>: First, let me add that both Mr. O'Sullivan and I both are
>: approaching this proposal a bit "tongue-in-cheek."  You 
>: know how we Irish are.
>
>The Irish have enough troubles without some dweeb like you claiming to
be
>one. Give them a break, they have suffered enough.
>
>:  [VBG] If either of us thought there 
>: was really a realistic chance his proposed amendment might 
>: pass we would both run away in fright.  However, it does 
>: offer a good opportunity to discuss the issues.
>
>Hardly, it instead points out the fears of social conservatives and
other
>loons, of people having individual freedom to engage in activites they
>don't like.
>
>:           =================================================
>: > Papa Jack (papajack@express-news.net) wrote:
>: > : "ABOUT HARNESSING THE SUPREME COURT"
>:  
>: > : Would you vote for a constitutional amendment saying:
>:  
>: > :   "No law passed by Congress and signed by the
>: > :    President shall be declared unconstitutional
>: > :    by the courts."
>
>:           =================================================
>: > Kevin Kelly wrote:
>: > Absolutly amazing. Remove one of the checks and balances 
>: > from the system because a bunch of right wingers feel 
>: > threatened that people have freedoms that they don't like.
>
>:          =================================================
>: Papa Jack comments:
>: Let's look at our current checks and balances:
>
>:  a. PRESIDENT - checked by Congress' ability to override vetos,
>:     checked by the Supreme Court's power to rule actions are 
>:     illegal or unconstitutional, and checked by elections every 
>:     four years.
>
>:  b. CONGRESS - checked by President's veto authority, checked 
>:     by the Supreme Court's power to rule actions are illegal or 
>:     unconstitutional, and checked by elections every four years.
>
>:  c. SUPREME COURT - checked only by Congress' power to pass 
>:     Constitutional Amendments through an extremely awkard and 
>:     slow legislative process which takes years to complete.  
>:     NOT subject to Presidential veto, congressional override, 
>:     or elections.
>
>You whine about tyranny of the SC. Yet in reality the tyranny you
would
>support is that of you and your fellow travellers. If your views
really
>and trully represent the beleifs of the the public at large than
getting
>them enshrined through the proper process should be something that can
be
>accomplished. What we see however is a an implicit admission that your
>views are not the majority views.
>
>: Not very impressive checks and balances against tyranny by
>: the SC, huh?
>
>What tyranny Jack. I have asked you to spell it out and you choose not
to.
>What are you whining about? And remember real world examples.
>
>:           =================================================
>: > Kevin Kelly wrote:
>: > Here's a free clue. If the very same Congress and President 
>: > pass a law outlawing guns and freedom of speech and freedom 
>: > of association, it would be constituional under this childish 
>: > concept.
>
>:          =================================================
>: Papa Jack comments:
>: Let's look at the 10th Amendment. 
>
>And ignore the point being made. You might be rather impressed with
>yourself Jack by cutting and pasting text from another repsonse of
yours.
>I think it shows a failure in your ability to think.
>
> For all practical purposes,
>: the SC has simply decided to ignore this vital part of the Bill 
>: of Rights.  In a 1941 decision, U.S. vs. Darby, Chief Justice 
>: Harlan Fiske Stone reduced the amendment to rubble, describing 
>: it merely declatory of intergovernmental relationships and as 
>: having no substantive meaning. (The Oxford Companion to the 
>: Supreme Court, p. 863).  
>
>Specifics Jack. Case cite, ruling, and vote. In addition other cases
that
>draw on this decision as the basis of subsequent decisisons. Otherwise
I
>am hardly convinced of your claim as to what has been done.  If you
wern;t
>a liar I wouldn't necessarily ask you to support your claim.
>
>: That's a cornerstone of the Bill of Rights!  All legal scholars 
>: admit the SC's creative interpretations of the "commerce clause" 
>: have clearly exceeded any possible interpretation of what the 
>: Founding Fathers intended.
>
>Quite possibly, and of course you speak out again the law on "Partial
>Birth abortions" for the same reason right? After all it relys on the
>commerce clause.
>
>: I could write pages more about the
>: obvious abuses by the SC over the social structures of our 
>: nation.
>
>Do it. I see nothing but vacous whining wihtout any substence. SHow us
>what you are complaining about.
>
>: My point -- and it's the same point that Judge Bork and others
>: have made -- is that you are worrying about what the President
>: and Congress could theoretically do. 
>
>I am not worring about any theoretical notion. The CDA  is no theory
twit.
>It's a law that violates the first amendment passed by congress and
the
>president to keep social conservativeshappy. And under your
brilliantly
>childish scheme it's constituional.
>
> The Supreme Court is
>: already doing it.
>
>Examples and lots of them please.
>
>  They take an oath to protect and defend 
>: the Constitution of the United States, but they violate that
>: oath daily.
>
>Really? Then since the Court is back in session please list the
violations
>of the last few weeks. A day by day breakdown will suffice with
>appropriate cites. Thanks.
>
>:           ==================================================
>: > : Papa Jack wrote:
>: > : Has the Supreme Court's judicial usurption disfranchised
>: > : Americans on vital moral questions?
>
>:           =================================================
>: > Kevin Kelly wrote: 
>: > BullshittoEnglish Translator: Has the move towards personal 
>: > freedom and responsibility made a bunch of control freaks 
>: > unhappy and plotting to destroy the delicate framework of 
>: > government.
>
>:          =================================================
>: Papa Jack comments:
>: Don't you think that's a bit heavy, KK?
>
>Nope. Your whining above is a classic example.  WHat moral questions
have
>you been disefranchised about? Be specific and show that they involve
>anything but personal freedom of others.
>
>:  Now, please translate
>: your point into specific examples or statements that I can
>: deal with. 
>
>: The only logical reply to a flame is another,
>: better flame 
>
>And theres nothing to worry about as far as that goes with you.
>
>:-- and we said we'd skip the flames this time
>: around.
>
>No you said you would, I didn't.
>
>:           ==================================================
>: > : Papa Jack wrote: 
>: > : This is the main thrust of Judge Robert H. Bork's new
>: > : book, _Slouching Towards Gomorrah_ -- as well as in a
>: > : joint effort in the journal, "First Things," where Judge
>: > : Bork is joined by Hadley Arkes, Russell Hittinger, Robert
>: > : George, and Charles Colson.
>:  
>: > : National Review's editor, John O'Sullivan, suggests a
>: > : constitutional amendment, as shown above to significantly
>: > : limit the SC's ability to arbitrarily establish social
>: > : policies.
>
>:           =================================================
>: > Kevin Kelly wrote: 
>: > Let's see. Jack you against contraceptives? How about mixed 
>: > marriages?  Beside abortion whcih I can see some argument 
>: > what is it the "conservatives" fear? Be specific jack and do 
>: > try to respond with real world points and support for those 
>: > points.
>
>:          =================================================
>: Papa Jack comments:
>: I do not understand your point.  I am not against either 
>: contraceptives or mixed marriages.
>
>You see Jack, these are things that the SC allowed by overturning as
>unconstituional laws set up by social conservatives such as yourself.
>These are things we take as clearly being within the framework of
personal
>freedom, yet according to you you beleive that you may decide these
issues
>for me and others as you feel disenfranchised about social issues.
>
>: The conservatives main fear is that we are losing the 
>: constitutional principles established by our Founding 
>: Fathers.
>
>Like men only voting or blacks not being citizens? WHen are you going
to
>wake up to the fact the constitution is a living breathing instrument
and
>not some hide bound document that's only meaning is what some
>"consrvative" wishes it to be?
>
>:  As noted above, the SC has played a major role
>: by crushing the 9th and 10th Amendments to the Bill of
>: Rights,
>
>No the SC hardly did that. Those with power do that. 
>
>: and by watering down the spirit and intent of the
>: 2nd Amendment.
>
>According to your moronic idea the 2nda amendment can be repealed by a
law
>of congress and the president signing it.
>
>:  Social engineering in the form of decisions
>: such as Roe v. Wade are bad law -- plain and simple --
>
>Name the other social engineering Jack and show that is something
other
>than people exercising their personal freedom.
>
>: based on newly discovered "Constitutional rights" which
>: fit whatever current fad of social engineering is popular.
>
>Hmmm do you think you should be told who you should marry or not? Or
if
>you use contraceptives? Those are some of things that were allowed by
what
>you call social engineering. WHat we see people moving to is the
concept
>of individual liberty. ANd what we see in reaction is those who feel
that
>this is a threat to them and their power structures and therefore are
>somehow evil.
>
>: To carry that a step further, the conservatives fear we
>: are sacrificing the moral principles which made this 
>: country great.
>
>Like what? 
>
>:  We see the deterioration of the American
>: family, with expanding divorce rates, increasing numbers of
>: children raised by single moms, growing drug abuse rates,
>: ... you know the routine.
>
>Yup and I know that the SC is not responsible for these activities. If
the
>choice is between living in a loveless marriage or getting a divorce,
get
>the divorce. If people resort to drugs do you think your laws against
them
>are stopping them. People take drugs to escape jack. What is it they
are
>escaping?  A SC decision? 
>
>  They are all true and they all
>: threaten the future of my grandchildren. 
>
>No they don't. What threatens your grandchildren is an insitence that
they
>not think and follow a programming of their lives set out by those who
are
>afraid of life.
>
>:           ==================================================
>: > : Papa Jack wrote: 
>: > : Mr. O'Sullivan admits this proposal is probably too
>: > : radical to pass, but it would at least get us to discus-
>: > : sing the powers of the Supreme Court.  Such debate would
>: > : be healthy for the people -- and might send a message
>: > : to those who would practice tyranny from the bench.
>
>:           =================================================
>: > Kevin Kelly wrote: 
>: > And the message being you want your tyranny instead.
>
>:          =================================================
>: Papa Jack comments:
>: How would expanding the authority of the President and 
>: Congress help ME impose MY tyranny?
>
>WHy because then it would be easier for you to get your perversion of
what
>society should be enforced by law. Laws that would be overturned as
they
>are unconstituional.
>
>:  Last time I checked
>: Clinton was a liberal Democrat doing all the things I hate.
>: And, I'm not that sure I'm all that happy with our GOP
>: majority in Congress -- they're a bunch of wimps.
>
>Wimps? The most idealogical congress in years and they are wimps. 
Scorch
>and burn eh Jack?
>
>:           ==================================================
>: > : Papa Jack wrote: 
>: > : What do you think?
>
>:           =================================================
>: > Kevin Kelly wrote:
>: > I think anyone proposing such is an enemy of freedom and 
>: > wishes to enforce moral standards on those that don;t share 
>: > them. That you bring this up as anything approaching worthy 
>: > of discussion is not surprising. What scares you so much 
>: > about personal freedom jack?
>
>:          =================================================
>: Papa Jack comments:
>: First, remember what I said at first.  This is a debate exercise
>: for both John O'Sullivan and me.  I would NOT seriously propose
>: the amendment in question.
>
>: But, I am a bit amazed that you would interpret the amendment
>: as an attempt to enforce moral standards on anyone.  How do
>: you envision that would work?  Remember what the proposed 
>: amendment said:
>
>: 	"No law passed by Congress and signed by the
>:          President shall be declared unconstitutional
>:          by the courts."
>
>And do remember what else you said about being disenfranchised about
>social issues? I say you were smarter than this but that would be a
lie.
>
>: That involves a total of 546 elected representatives of all
>: parties.  Not very good material for a conspiracy of right
>: wingers.  
>
>Let's see a bunch of politicians whose only concern according to some
is
>their own re-election would never ever pass a law that removed the
liberty
>of someone simply because a majority of people thought it ok to do so.
Or
>how about them doing it if the majority of people don't know the
issue?
>Geez and they would never pass anything to limit my right to free
specch
>because a bunch of conservatives demans it? I guess the CDA is a
figment
>of my imagination.
>
>: There is not a thing which scares me about personal freedom, 
>: KK.  In fact, I believe conservatives are far more concerned 
>: about personal freedoms than are those who prefer more col-
>: lectivist forms of government.
>
>Well I don;t see it from the bunch that call themsleves conservatives.
>Real conservatives maybe but not your bunch.
>
>--
>The power of accurate observation is commonly 
>called cynicism by those who have not got it. 
>- George Bernard Shaw 

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 31 07:57:25 PST 1996
Article: 496321 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: talk.politics.misc,talk.politics.libertarian,talk.abortion,dc.politics,alt.president.clinton,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.politics.usa.newt-gingrich,alt.politics.usa.misc,alt.politics.usa.constitution,alt.politics.usa.congress,alt.politics.reform,alt.p
Subject: Re: how do Hillary/Feminists justify the slaughter preborn sisters ???
Date: 29 Oct 1996 19:59:06 GMT
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In <553rvg$qqd@jeeves.usfca.edu> elizabeth frantes
 writes: 

 Another good one! "Give me (and women) liberty or give me (and jerks)
death."

>swbuza@nemaine.com (Stephen Buza) wrote:
>
>>It is a black and white issue.
>
>No, it isn't, unless you have a very limited intellect.
>"Concrete" thinking is often a sign of brain damage.
>
>  If you don't vote during these
>>elections, then you don't have the right to bitch about their
outcome.
>>If you don't take a stand against abortion, then you don't have the
>>right to feel "sick to your stomach" when someone kills their child.
>
>One can feel any way one wants.
>I feel bad about the dead civilians in Iraq.
>But I do not oppose the military.
>Should a person not against gun control not feel
>anything when some gunnut blows away a bunch of
>kids, like what happened in Scotland long ago?
>
>And a fetus is not a child.
>
>>It makes me sick to my stomach when people know that abortion
>>is wrong but are too cowardly to take a stand against it.
>
>OK--soo why not eliminate all abortions by using the same 
>method that the livestock industry has used for years?
>They simply castrate males.  It's cheap, has virtually no
>side effects, and it WORKS.  Fertility of the females is
>thus controlled.  We could save sperm when a male is an
>adolescent, then whack off their balls, so they would NEVER
>impregnate a woman.
>
>Hey, if you want to tell me what to do with my body,
>I get to do the same.  
>
>My method is much cheaper, since no foster homes/orphanges/
>jails will be needed for unwanted children.  It would probably reduce 
>the violent crime rate, as well.
>
>>Those of us who are opposed to abortion used to be called pro-life.
>
>if they also opose warfare, capital punishment, etc, I'd call 'em
>pro-life. 
>
>>Now we are called anti-abortion because the media has determined
>>that "pro-life" is a misnomer.  That's ok, though because I am
>>anti-abortion.
>
>Fine, don't get one.
>
>>Funny thing is, the term "pro-choice" is much more of a misnomer than
>>pro-life ever was.  Pro-choice is much less about choice than it is
>>about killing preborn children. 
>
>There is no such thing as an unborn child.  Are you a predead corpse?
>And the deal is that the WOMAN gets to choose.  What, you don't think
>women should be allowed to choose?
>Well, we could save lives if YOU donate blood and body parts.
>You don't need both kidneys.  Bone marrow extraction is much less
>painful than childbirth.  You can spare 1 pint of blood every 6 weeks.
>Needless to say when you die, the docs get to take all the bits they 
>want, then use your body for training ppurposes.  Hell, after you die,
>why not save lives?  It's not like YOU"LL be needing the parts, then!
>
> If you cared about choice, you'd care
>>about the choice of the child.  I believe in personal choice.
>
>
>and being male, you need never face the consequences of your
"morality".
>
>>  I do
>>not believe, however, that the right to personal choice is more
>>important than the right to live. 
>
>"Give me liberty of give me death">
>
> Our history is full of tempering
>
>tampering
>>the right to choose when that choice has an adverse effect on the
life
>>of another individual.
>
>Please note that abortion was legal when the Constitution was put in
>effect.  They didn't care.  A fetus does not have any rights.
>Never did.  
>When abortion was illegal, rich women went to another country
>or bribed a doctor.  Illegal abortion is simply taking choice away
>from the poor.  Rich women will get nice safe aboritons elsewhere.
>
>>In the end, its just semantics.  Either you oppose abortion, or you
>>support it.  It's as simple as that.
>
>Here's something simple:
>You can oppose abortion all you want.  Fine.
>Don't get one.  Dobn't perform one.
>If you tell me what to do with my body, I tell you
>what to do with yours.
>
>And you won't like what I have in mind.
>
>
>eaf
>
>

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia


From sma4@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 31 18:24:00 PST 1996
Article: 497214 of talk.politics.misc
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From: sma4@ix.netcom.com(Steven Malcolm Anderson)
Newsgroups: alt.politics.usa.constitution,talk.politics.misc,talk.abortion,alt.politics.usa.republican,alt.current-events..usa,
Subject: Re: "ABOUT HARNESSING THE SUPREME COURT"
Date: 31 Oct 1996 17:32:44 GMT
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 Papa Jack:
 Specifically, which SC decisions are you objecting to, other than Roe
vs. Wade?: Brown vs. Board of Education? Griswold vs. Connecticut?
Stanley vs. Georgia? Hint: all of these decisions protected our
PERSONAL FREEDOMS. OK, Bowers vs. Hardwick was lousy, but your proposed
remedy would hardly fix that.
 Mr. Kelly asked you this exact same question and you just called him
names and ran away without answering it. If you fail to answer this
question, to clarify your stand on our PERSONAL FREEDOMS, then I will
be forced to conclude what others have concluded about you. 

-- 
sma4@ix.netcom.com
"The concept of 'greatness' entails being noble,
 wanting to be by oneself,
 being capable of being different, standing alone..." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"Identity is shaped through confict and opposition." -Camille Paglia

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