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         Nazi Conspiracy & Aggression, Supplement B
       Who Was Responsible for the Concentration Camps
     Excerpts from Testimony of Oswald Pohl, taken at
     Nurnberg, Germany, 10 June 1946, 1400-1700, by Lt.
     Col. Smith W. Brookhart, Jr., IGD. Also present:
     Richard Sonnenfeldt, Interpreter; Charles J.
     Gallagher, Reporter.
                                                 [Page 1600]
Q. Let me read some of Kaltenbrunner's testimony. He was
being questioned about the deaths that occurred in
concentration camps, and this question was put: "Because
they continued to be done through 1943, 1944, and 1945, and
until the Allied Armies overran the concentration camps, and
through those years Kaltenbrunner was Chief of the RSHA
which had them in charge.

"A. No, I was never in charge of any such, but orders were
generally like such in my statement in London, that Himmler

                                                 [Page 1601]
or Pohl, and no commander of any concentration camp on the
part of Germany can ever say he ever received the slightest
order from me."

A. I can give you exactly the same answer. No concentration
camp commandant ever received the slightest order from me,
either written or oral. The WVHA [Economics and
Administration Main Office (of SS), in charge of
concentration camps and headed by Pohl.] did not have the
slightest jurisdiction over the prisoners. Any such order
could only come from Himmler, or from the RSHA, [Reich
Security Main Office, headed by Kaltenbrunner.] from
Mueller, head of Amt IV. I do not know whether Kaltenbrunner
knew about it in every case, but at any rate any such orders
never emanated from the WVHA, or from me.

Q. You and Kaltenbrunner contradict each other at almost
every turn.

A. Well, I am telling you the truth.

Q. Kaltenbrunner says that in all his dealings with you he
never referred to the concentration camps.

A. That is an error. I already testified to this fact, and I
am insisting on it that I wrote quite a number of letters to
Kaltenbrunner to release several prisoners and that cannot
be changed. Those letters would be entirely surplusage if I
myself ever had the power to take them out, because would
have simply to say, "Take them out."

Q. You stand on your oral testimony that when you wanted to
deal with any one about taking a prisoner out of a camp, you
took it up with Kaltenbrunner, is that right?

A. Yes, I insist on that absolutely, and I will not change
it. The whole thing is so clear that any error is absolutely
out of the question. Some of my collaborators, no doubt,
would be in a position to testify whether or not I had
authority to release prisoners. Loerner would know that, and
Hoess perhaps.

Q. Here you make out Kaltenbrunner as a liar when he is on
trial for his life when he gave this testimony?

A. It is not true insofar as he refers to me. That is
absolutely not true.

Q. Kaltenbrunner says if he can be confronted by you he will
say that you are the responsible person always.

A. Please confront me with him.

Q. In connection with the Jewish extermination program,
Kaltenbrunner said this: "During my time" -- meaning his
time with the RSHA -- "I have repeatedly opposed such
persecution of the Jews; particularly in view of those
reasons I have declined to take charge of this office." What
do you know about that? He said further, "The responsibility
rests with Himmler, Mueller, and Pohl."

                                                 [Page 1602]
A. In this Kaltenbrunner makes only one mistake. He put in
the name of Pohl instead of Kaltenbrunner, and I will tell
you why. If I oppose anything, that means that I have
something to do with it; how can I possible oppose something
I did not have anything to do with?

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